-
Read the WELCOME ALL BMWFANATICS post.
JB4 (N54/N55) Support Thread, South Africa
- Thread starter Twinz
- Start date
sanesh21
///Member
@boosted,
Your settings look fine to me, only thing I would adjust is max boost limit, raise it to 20psi, if it hit 18psi while you were on good fuel, you were probably bounced to map4 because of this.
- I see the timing pull in run1. Throttle closure is linked to this as well,
Are you logging with dtc off?
-Certain ewg cars behave adversely with ethanol content, and as such run lean. Can you post up the log on excel as the graph csv cannot pin point all parameters conclusively ?
-run2 is much cleaner, could perhaps be the map5 adaptation had "adapted" better and hence pulled cleaner. Especially if this is a back to back run
Remember on map5 give it at least 3 full pulls to adapt properly when changing maps.
- please also advise what fueling this was on.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk HD
Your settings look fine to me, only thing I would adjust is max boost limit, raise it to 20psi, if it hit 18psi while you were on good fuel, you were probably bounced to map4 because of this.
- I see the timing pull in run1. Throttle closure is linked to this as well,
Are you logging with dtc off?
-Certain ewg cars behave adversely with ethanol content, and as such run lean. Can you post up the log on excel as the graph csv cannot pin point all parameters conclusively ?
-run2 is much cleaner, could perhaps be the map5 adaptation had "adapted" better and hence pulled cleaner. Especially if this is a back to back run
Remember on map5 give it at least 3 full pulls to adapt properly when changing maps.
- please also advise what fueling this was on.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk HD
Hi Sanesh/ Twinz,
Yes all logs done with DSC completely deactivated, I did do some 3rd gear pulls but found i was getting wheelsman so These pulls are in 4th.
Will up boost limit to 20.
Fuel used is 10% ethanol, Sasol 95.
AFR run mid 13's
it won't let me load csv files.
I can mail them to you if you prefer?
Thanks
Mike
Yes all logs done with DSC completely deactivated, I did do some 3rd gear pulls but found i was getting wheelsman so These pulls are in 4th.
Will up boost limit to 20.
Fuel used is 10% ethanol, Sasol 95.
AFR run mid 13's
it won't let me load csv files.
I can mail them to you if you prefer?
Thanks
Mike
dvst8
///Member
BoostedGP said:
Forced Induction Direct Injection motors seem to run much leaner AFR's in general.
Twinz and Sanesh of both masters with the JB unit and reading the logs. An accurate assessment can only be given by reading the raw data produced by logging ie. Thise CSV files.
Perhaps emailing the CsV's may be an option ? One would need to look at other log elements with the AFR to accuratley assess if the car is running lean or not.
:coolShake:
Hey guys. Ok so I finally got some logs on 20% ethanol to email you guys.
One question. How do you limit boost in map 5. I thought that under user settings if you profile a boost curve then map 5 will adhere to it. (Is that tab not a global settings?) I have set it up to be a max of 16 psi from 3-5k. And yet it is still boosting to over 18psi.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Also is there an easy way (without a laptop) to see what map you are on?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
One question. How do you limit boost in map 5. I thought that under user settings if you profile a boost curve then map 5 will adhere to it. (Is that tab not a global settings?) I have set it up to be a max of 16 psi from 3-5k. And yet it is still boosting to over 18psi.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Also is there an easy way (without a laptop) to see what map you are on?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
BoostedGP said:
WRT checking the map, I use the USB with an OTG cable and connect it to my android tablet - That way it shows what map you're on at a glance when using the JB app.
Sent from my iPhone 6+ using Tapatalk
cOlDFuSiOn
New member
Big question from my side... I drive my 335i hard... As it is intended to, not abusively just hard..
So if I run a daily over boost of 1.2bar from what I can see the JB4 pushes it to am I Iooking at issues or can the internals/turbo really handle it?
Some other tuning house I spoke with reckons the JB4 pushes boost too high hence the nice gains which is cool for a track car and all but for a daily driven one? So how high do you guys run boost daily? I want about 300wkw out of the car. Is that safe?
Asking because I know I'll get some real answers here.. Need more power but reliability is a concern to me too..
Thanks! :=):
So if I run a daily over boost of 1.2bar from what I can see the JB4 pushes it to am I Iooking at issues or can the internals/turbo really handle it?
Some other tuning house I spoke with reckons the JB4 pushes boost too high hence the nice gains which is cool for a track car and all but for a daily driven one? So how high do you guys run boost daily? I want about 300wkw out of the car. Is that safe?
Asking because I know I'll get some real answers here.. Need more power but reliability is a concern to me too..
Thanks! :=):
cOlDFuSiOn said:
From what I've seen, the M135 can really get 1.2 bar (or 17-18psi) when eth is being used, granted that was with an outside temp of around 3,5 degrees (iat at between 20 and 35 deg) and avg ignition at around 0.9, while on Map 5.
Haven't seen it push up that high on pump fuel.
What I take out of that is the higher octane, coupled with the low temperatures allow the JB to reach that target boost safely.
In terms of whether the engine car handle it, I haven't experienced enough to comment on that. Though if you're going to get a constant 1.2 bar out of it, regardless of external factors, that would be alarming to me.
Just my 2c with my limited knowledge lol.
Sent from my iPhone 6+ using Tapatalk
cOlDFuSiOn
New member
Fuzz@TheDynamikProject said:
Thank you Sir Fuzz!!
I guess my concern as well is that I see a lot of high power dyno graphs but I can't but wonder that was only a tune to see how high they can push it with Octane boosters and the lot. Nobody really runs with 5/600hp max tuned daily. If they do I would like some feedback :cartel:
The car gets rolled off the dyno and a lower boost map is loaded. Like I said I am overly keen to get the ball rolling with mods on the car but I need a path to know that I can safely get what I want put of the car daily. I suspect it can but want some feedback from high HP daily drives.
You can can clearly read between the lines that I got my a$$ handed to me by a stock 2.0T
Such an embarassment as I had a bud in the car with me :thumbdo:
Magneto
New member
You are going to need a number of hardware mods. Don't think you can just stick in a tune then pump up the boost, without supporting mods, because your car will break. For a daily drive I wouldn't push the car to the max. If you lost to a stock 2.0T then your 335i is broken and should be repaired before you consider modding it.
Provided the 2.0T wasn't a A45AMG or similar
Provided the 2.0T wasn't a A45AMG or similar
cOlDFuSiOn said:Fuzz@TheDynamikProject said:
Thank you Sir Fuzz!!
I guess my concern as well is that I see a lot of high power dyno graphs but I can't but wonder that was only a tune to see how high they can push it with Octane boosters and the lot. Nobody really runs with 5/600hp max tuned daily. If they do I would like some feedback :cartel:
The car gets rolled off the dyno and a lower boost map is loaded. Like I said I am overly keen to get the ball rolling with mods on the car but I need a path to know that I can safely get what I want put of the car daily. I suspect it can but want some feedback from high HP daily drives.
You can can clearly read between the lines that I got my a$$ handed to me by a stock 2.0T
Such an embarassment as I had a bud in the car with me :thumbdo:
Ahahahahahahaha it happens, sadly
But - get a JB, set it to map 5 and let the auto tune sort you out - there's no need to run crazy power daily, as you've stated, and for me anyway, map 5 gives me what I need safely while taking everything else that I don't want to worry about into account :thumbs:
Sent from my iPhone 6+ using Tapatalk
cOlDFuSiOn
New member
Magneto said:
A45AMG! Wing and all is all I saw! Nice cars hence my question if a 2.0T can push that power reliably then surely a 3.0T must do better than a mesely 225kw.. No comments on my car thus far so I guess is it healthy! :=):
Fuzz@TheDynamikProject said:cOlDFuSiOn said:Fuzz@TheDynamikProject said:
Thank you Sir Fuzz!!
I guess my concern as well is that I see a lot of high power dyno graphs but I can't but wonder that was only a tune to see how high they can push it with Octane boosters and the lot. Nobody really runs with 5/600hp max tuned daily. If they do I would like some feedback :cartel:
The car gets rolled off the dyno and a lower boost map is loaded. Like I said I am overly keen to get the ball rolling with mods on the car but I need a path to know that I can safely get what I want put of the car daily. I suspect it can but want some feedback from high HP daily drives.
You can can clearly read between the lines that I got my a$$ handed to me by a stock 2.0T
Such an embarassment as I had a bud in the car with me :thumbdo:
Ahahahahahahaha it happens, sadly
But - get a JB, set it to map 5 and let the auto tune sort you out - there's no need to run crazy power daily, as you've stated, and for me anyway, map 5 gives me what I need safely while taking everything else that I don't want to worry about into account :thumbs:
Sent from my iPhone 6+ using Tapatalk
Thanks! I think that with a bolt on here and there should give me just enough to pepper those blasted AMGs! :cartel:
Just to add. Remember that at jhb atmospheric pressure is 0.2bar lower than the coast so a car at the coast at 1 bar is equal in total manifold pressure (manifold absolute pressure ) to a jhb car running 1.2 bar boost. Giving a total of 2bar MAP.
Also 265kw for a 2 liter is not a lot. 150kw/L is getting a lot.
Also a track car works way harder than a street car. A street car will be lucky if it spends 3% of its life at WOT. A race/track car will be closer to 65%.
So a high hp street car is not stressing a motor too much. The biggest problem with street cars is the variation in fuel quality from the pumps. Or that the user doesn't realize the importance of 2 octane difference or 5% difference in ethanol content.
On a direct injection motor 1.2 bar is reasonable boost. Due to the fact the Ecu can give a little squirt of fuel to start the burn and then the rest as the cylinder pressures drop. But an old style port injection is one lot at a time.
On various cars 9.5-10.5:1 compression I have reliable run 2.2- 2.8 bar boost on ethanol (E75) and did 20000+km of hard track / gymkhana use without any realizability issues. Running 450kw and 750nm on a stick bottom end 2L. And 750kw and 1200nm on 2.3L built motor.
It's all about managing your total BMEP (break mean effective pressure) on the piston tops. And if managed properly all is good.
This is one of the reasons why the jb4 doesn't get peak boost till after 3000rpm.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Also 265kw for a 2 liter is not a lot. 150kw/L is getting a lot.
Also a track car works way harder than a street car. A street car will be lucky if it spends 3% of its life at WOT. A race/track car will be closer to 65%.
So a high hp street car is not stressing a motor too much. The biggest problem with street cars is the variation in fuel quality from the pumps. Or that the user doesn't realize the importance of 2 octane difference or 5% difference in ethanol content.
On a direct injection motor 1.2 bar is reasonable boost. Due to the fact the Ecu can give a little squirt of fuel to start the burn and then the rest as the cylinder pressures drop. But an old style port injection is one lot at a time.
On various cars 9.5-10.5:1 compression I have reliable run 2.2- 2.8 bar boost on ethanol (E75) and did 20000+km of hard track / gymkhana use without any realizability issues. Running 450kw and 750nm on a stick bottom end 2L. And 750kw and 1200nm on 2.3L built motor.
It's all about managing your total BMEP (break mean effective pressure) on the piston tops. And if managed properly all is good.
This is one of the reasons why the jb4 doesn't get peak boost till after 3000rpm.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
cOlDFuSiOn
New member
Thanks BoostedGP this is some valuable information!
I have a lot to learn in regards to modding hence I am asking random questions, I get (some of it) what you explain with regards to pressure on the pistons. I am going to go read up more on the fueling now! Guess I like to know what the ECU decides to do under which conditions what will ultimately make me more comfortable with a JB4!
Schweet appreciate the comments! :ty:
I have a lot to learn in regards to modding hence I am asking random questions, I get (some of it) what you explain with regards to pressure on the pistons. I am going to go read up more on the fueling now! Guess I like to know what the ECU decides to do under which conditions what will ultimately make me more comfortable with a JB4!
Schweet appreciate the comments! :ty:
Basically there are 3 criteria for hurting a motor. Fuel boost and timing. If a motor knocks (ping or det) it will pull tuning and usually richen the air fuel mixture. I.e. 12:1 instead of 13:1. Also if the air temp goes up. The Ecu will add fuel to cool the mixture and pull some boost and timing. Ideally you want to get the correct afr for a desired boost. Then add timing till you see no more power increase. Take 1 or 2 deg out and set it at that. If you can't get the ideal timing you need to reduce boost. Ideally you want to have the ideal afr and best timing. With as much boost as the timing can take without pulling inside MF. If you are getting timing pull. You should reduce boost. More boost less timing might yield more power but at the cost of consistency. Also the cooler, turbo, will be working harder and egt will be higher. As well as an increase in thermal loading on the motor.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Similar threads
