illegal drag race crash in Durban

[WIDEOPN-X5]

Have a look at the front of the Merc. See the big concrete blocks?

Have a look at the damage to the Golf particularly front and rear. I think one can rule out opposite direction of travel.

Return to the Merc. See the bonnet. Not crumpled. So I think one can rule out a t-bone.

But like you said, I wasn't there......... but in 18yrs I've never been at the accident scene before the accident and able to witness it. That's why we call it reconstruction:=):

 

[Sabretooth tiger]

:facepalm:

 

[STech]

Have a look at the front of the Merc. See the big concrete blocks?

Have a look at the damage to the Golf particularly front and rear. I think one can rule out opposite direction of travel.

Return to the Merc. See the bonnet. Not crumpled. So I think one can rule out a t-bone.

But like you said, I wasn't there......... but in 18yrs I've never been at the accident scene before the accident and able to witness it. That's why we call it reconstruction:=):

Awesome....

Now who WON?

:roflol:

 

[TurboLlew]

If you were speeding or going over the speed limit before a crash , insurance can repudiate the claim?

In theory yes.

But the clincher is when the owner brags on social media about his/her exploits.

Slightly off topic for a minute, but I have met many people who think they are covered for track days (non timed, non competitive stipulated in the t's and c's). I myself had to go through the ordeal of trying to get a track claim paid, WITH cover for track use and at an event without official timing. Some even state you can be the only car out on track at the time (so which event apart from maybe skidpan would be covered). Wait and see what happens when you try to claim, but have posted your racechrono time from some point in the past on a closed forum/group somewhere... On whatsapp with all the groups, the info is being screenshotted/forwarded immediately to a half dozen other groups. Insurers will even find captioned pictures from OTHER people's blogs and social media who may have unofficially timed you. They will put 2 and 2 together.

Two mates have had to fight to have a hail claim paid out and windscreen claim paid because the cars were seen at a gymkhana event on social media (MiWay). They fought these successfully but it becomes painful. Someone from MiWay actually tried to gain admin access to another forum since they heard of a hidden street racing section...

Now if you are insured and attending 'real' events, but face that kind of scrutiny, then what do you think awaits the two guys in this incident? I don't think many people realise how stressful this process can be long after the trauma is over. The standards of evidence are not the same as those of a court of law... I certainly don't envy the fight on these guys hands.

Everyone should read those policies, exclusions about performance mods, exclusions about competition use, what constitutes pleasure vs. competition, what defines a competitive event etc. UNDERSTAND them fully and if anything isn't clear, get it clarified in writing so that an argument with the ombudsman is actually an option afterwards.

Regardless of whether this was a cruise or street racing, I am doubtful that this will be paid even if they involve the ombudsman. Insurers get 'scared' of the ombudsman in more mundane cases for sure and hence speeding etc. are somewhat easier to get away with. This is one where they are likely to stick to their guns for as long as possible IMHO. In this thread there is someone claiming that he was street racing just before this. Randomly meeting up with a 'recklessly speeding' A45 on the way home is unlikely to be believable given the circumstances. Whether guys know them personally or not, people make all sorts of claims and assumptions online which are visible and which are used by insurers. They/we can delete these comments but its out there now and likely in a number of other places including all the 'offline' groups where these things are shared and discussed as well. Such is the world we live in nowadays.

 

[ChefDJ]

Someone from MiWay actually tried to gain admin access to another forum since they heard of a hidden street racing section...

:thinking:

Got any more info on this?

 

[WIDEOPN-X5]

Llew:clapper::clapper::clapper:

Eloquently stated what I was trying unsuccessfully to get out there.

To add to your brilliant summation, there's SAPS crime scene bunting visible in the photos which would suggest that they were called. It doesn't necessarily follow that this was due to fatalities but it does suggest that the accident unit is involved. I am fairly confident that at least 2 charges of reckless and negligent driving have been lodged.

The result? Well at the very least the "innocently cruising" Golf driver now has legal defence costs to add to his misery if a prosecution is pursued.

 

[dvst8]

Have a look at the front of the Merc. See the big concrete blocks?

Have a look at the damage to the Golf particularly front and rear. I think one can rule out opposite direction of travel.

Return to the Merc. See the bonnet. Not crumpled. So I think one can rule out a t-bone.

But like you said, I wasn't there......... but in 18yrs I've never been at the accident scene before the accident and able to witness it. That's why we call it reconstruction:=):

Awesome....

Now who WON?

:roflol:

Who was racing ?

 

[TurboLlew]

Someone from MiWay actually tried to gain admin access to another forum since they heard of a hidden street racing section...

:thinking:

Got any more info on this?

This is first hand info since I was the admin. There are 2 admin accounts on the forum and 95% of it requires signing up to view. Arbee is on there too and knows we had to actually post about it a couple of times to remind guys about the sensitive info they were posting. Turns out they wanted to access it because the guy claiming for hail damage had club stickers on the car.

Anyway, they first registered an account which we didn't activate since we have a whatsapp group for admins and mods that we chat on before we activate members, ban, control access to different areas etc. PHPBB is not the most secure of systems but it wasn't that terrible (this is some time ago bear in mind so security was not as good as now). Anyway, the account with a miway email address had seemingly activated itself a couple of hours later (remember we are a tiny group of mostly friends and friends-of-friends that are literally nowhere on the map vs. something like Fanatics or MyHonda etc. so this is a lot of effort to get info IMHO). Fortunately, activations are placed into a very locked down profile so they didn't get to any sensitive info... Admin and user logs conflicted and neither showed that the user was activated but yet they had been in the dbase... active and successfully jumped the fence so to speak. A short while after this, we see the same IP tried to gain access to the admin accounts (specific 2 names) noted as "Failed administration login attempt" with the IP. This is without even contacting any of the management team or even other members to ask for access, bother to pose as a new member etc... How randomly guessing passwords was an option puzzled us all. They were savvy enough to exploit *something* to get in, but not smart enough to get admin access and give themselves further access.

Would not be surprised if people were all over the forums and even whatsapp groups or even paid people on groups and forums to snitch.

 

[kilotango]

to be frank, i actually dont feel anything for the guys who were driving these cars.. rather, i feel for the family sitting at home/hospital wondering if a husband, dad, brother or son is about to die...

 

[salmaandhooma1]

Someone from MiWay actually tried to gain admin access to another forum since they heard of a hidden street racing section...

:thinking:

Got any more info on this?

This is first hand info since I was the admin. There are 2 admin accounts on the forum and 95% of it requires signing up to view. Arbee is on there too and knows we had to actually post about it a couple of times to remind guys about the sensitive info they were posting. Turns out they wanted to access it because the guy claiming for hail damage had club stickers on the car.

Anyway, they first registered an account which we didn't activate since we have a whatsapp group for admins and mods that we chat on before we activate members, ban, control access to different areas etc. PHPBB is not the most secure of systems but it wasn't that terrible (this is some time ago bear in mind so security was not as good as now). Anyway, the account with a miway email address had seemingly activated itself a couple of hours later (remember we are a tiny group of mostly friends and friends-of-friends that are literally nowhere on the map vs. something like Fanatics or MyHonda etc. so this is a lot of effort to get info IMHO). Fortunately, activations are placed into a very locked down profile so they didn't get to any sensitive info... Admin and user logs conflicted and neither showed that the user was activated but yet they had been in the dbase... active and successfully jumped the fence so to speak. A short while after this, we see the same IP tried to gain access to the admin accounts (specific 2 names) noted as "Failed administration login attempt" with the IP. This is without even contacting any of the management team or even other members to ask for access, bother to pose as a new member etc... How randomly guessing passwords was an option puzzled us all. They were savvy enough to exploit *something* to get in, but not smart enough to get admin access and give themselves further access.

Would not be surprised if people were all over the forums and even whatsapp groups or even paid people on groups and forums to snitch.

Holy moly! [SEE-NO-EVIL MONKEY][SEE-NO-EVIL MONKEY][SEE-NO-EVIL MONKEY][SEE-NO-EVIL MONKEY]

 

[Dewald Basson]

Fast and the Furious style: Ride or Die

 

[Willy]

“Reports from the scene suggest the two vehicles were allegedly racing, when one of the drivers lost control at high speed, colliding with the other vehicle, causing it to veer off the roadway, colliding with a wall."

 

[WIDEOPN-X5]

“Reports from the scene suggest the two vehicles were allegedly racing, when one of the drivers lost control at high speed, colliding with the other vehicle, causing it to veer off the roadway, colliding with a wall."

Big surprise.

But wait, Willy, were you there?:roflol::roflol::roflol::roflol:

I just got another appointment on a stolen vehicle investigation....but I had to tell the Underwriter that we couldn't take the appointment because none of my staff were there when the car was stolen. So it wasn't stolen. You know? 'Cos were weren't there.....:facepalm:

 

[Willy]

I was not there but the engineer in me knows that there almost no way for a 1500kg car to climb a wall if it was doing 60km/h even if it was helped.

 

[dvst8]

“Reports from the scene suggest the two vehicles were allegedly racing, when one of the drivers lost control at high speed, colliding with the other vehicle, causing it to veer off the roadway, colliding with a wall."

Big surprise.

But wait, Willy, were you there?:roflol::roflol::roflol::roflol:

I just got another appointment on a stolen vehicle investigation....but I had to tell the Underwriter that we couldn't take the appointment because none of my staff were there when the car was stolen. So it wasn't stolen. You know? 'Cos were weren't there.....:facepalm:

No reason for your snotty reply, I merely asked a question. You must be the best investigator around to be able to reconstruct this accident from 1 or 2 closeup pics. Wouldnt you need to analyse the broader scene for a reconstruction ?

Internet makes everyone an expert like IG makes everyone a supermodel.

 

[WIDEOPN-X5]

“Reports from the scene suggest the two vehicles were allegedly racing, when one of the drivers lost control at high speed, colliding with the other vehicle, causing it to veer off the roadway, colliding with a wall."

Big surprise.

But wait, Willy, were you there?:roflol::roflol::roflol::roflol:

I just got another appointment on a stolen vehicle investigation....but I had to tell the Underwriter that we couldn't take the appointment because none of my staff were there when the car was stolen. So it wasn't stolen. You know? 'Cos were weren't there.....:facepalm:

No reason for your snotty reply, I merely asked a question. You must be the best investigator around to be able to reconstruct this accident from 1 or 2 closeup pics. Wouldnt you need to analyse the broader scene for a reconstruction ?

Internet makes everyone an expert like IG makes everyone a supermodel.

Bud don't be a d**s. I was having a bit of a jibe. A chirp in jest. Learn to take as good as you give.:=):

In regard to a full reconstruction yes you're right, a full scene review would be required but years of experience also results in a keen eye for telltale signs that provide answers straight off the bat.

I don't think I'm a the best investigator around but I do pride myself and my company in attention to details. As a result we have conducted investigations as far a field as Venezuela for insurers. (Obviously not car related:=) so I guess we must be doing something right.

Lighten up... Life's too short.

D

PS: Now that I re-read the last paragraph it seems like I'm being arrogant.... I hope it doesn't come across that way. It's simply a fact. Anyway...C'est la vie.

 

[ChefDJ]

You have not been recognised. We do not want to ask you to withdraw from the chamber.

Please exercise respect :blowheart:

 

[WIDEOPN-X5]

I withdraw Honorable Chair:=)::=):

 

[dvst8]

“Reports from the scene suggest the two vehicles were allegedly racing, when one of the drivers lost control at high speed, colliding with the other vehicle, causing it to veer off the roadway, colliding with a wall."

Big surprise.

But wait, Willy, were you there?:roflol::roflol::roflol::roflol:

I just got another appointment on a stolen vehicle investigation....but I had to tell the Underwriter that we couldn't take the appointment because none of my staff were there when the car was stolen. So it wasn't stolen. You know? 'Cos were weren't there.....:facepalm:

No reason for your snotty reply, I merely asked a question. You must be the best investigator around to be able to reconstruct this accident from 1 or 2 closeup pics. Wouldnt you need to analyse the broader scene for a reconstruction ?

Internet makes everyone an expert like IG makes everyone a supermodel.

Bud don't be a doos. I was having a bit of a jibe. A chirp in jest. Learn to take as good as you give.:=):

In regard to a full reconstruction yes you're right, a full scene review would be required but years of experience also results in a keen eye for telltale signs that provide answers straight off the bat.

I don't think I'm a the best investigator around but I do pride myself and my company in attention to details. As a result we have conducted investigations as far a field as Venezuela for insurers. (Obviously not car related:=) so I guess we must be doing something right.

Lighten up... Life's too short.

D

PS: Now that I re-read the last paragraph it seems like I'm being arrogant.... I hope it doesn't come across that way. It's simply a fact. Anyway...C'est la vie.

I aplogise if I came accross as being a doos. Lemme explain .....

My initial question was not fully understanding your background. Im in no way suggesting that you dont know your job or what you talking about.

However, I have been witness to accidents where a car being driven at safe legal limits was hit by another speeding car and the result was shocking, with the "slow" car being flung and rolled a huge distance.

Im not saying that this is what happened here, however from what Ive witnessed it is still a possibility. The drivers friend posted here that they were not racing, the fact that he was out racing earlier does not prove that he was racing. Investigation will however reveal the truth. The driver should not be guilty by association cause then we are all doomed. As you said earlier, assumption is the mother of all f ups.

:=):

 

[individj]

so the golf won