Xcede vs JB4 on same car, same dyno

[Acheron]

Note, I'm not anti standalone flash, but to say that they are capable of giving significantly better results than the JB post-backend flash availability is simply not true. The fact is that those running these backend flashes have consistently seen improvement in power/driveability and as I've stated multiple times they are freely available to those wanting to use them.

Ok Terry quoted directly that you don't need a back end flash if you making less than 420hp.

As a tuner and with experience with the JB, I am saying (my opinion & Terry seems to confirm it) that you don't require a back end flash for a car with just a downpipe. The functionality that the back end flash provides that the JB cannot is not required in this case. The JB can adequately provide what is required on that front.

I can't help you if you aren't reading my post fully. I've just told you that the quote was taken out of context. It does not refer to ALL backend flashes, rather just to one specific backend flash for larger turbos.

What is so hard to understand? You wouldn't load that particular flash on JB+downpipe only car to begin with. Nowhere has Terry every said that ALL backend flashes are exclusively for 400+ hp cars. I cannot spell this out any better for you.

 

[Sherwin@xcede]

I can't help you if you aren't reading my post fully. I've just told you that the quote was taken out of context. It does not refer to ALL backend flashes, rather just to one specific backend flash for larger turbos.

What is so hard to understand? You wouldn't load that particular flash on JB+downpipe only car to begin with.

I'm not talking that particular post. I'm talking a blanket statement that you don't need a back end flash if you making less that 420whp. Not that particular post Chavoos quoted.

do you disagree? These are all words on a forum for now. Bring a car to a dyno & let's do this. I happen to know a little about this.

 

[Acheron]

Sherwin, who made the blanket statement you're referring to and please link me to it?

 

[Sherwin@xcede]

Ok let me break this down. You aren't answering my question & I know why.

So what happens when you remove the primary catts? And what tuning is required?

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Sherwin, who made the blanket statement you're referring to and please link me to it?

Terry made it. I don't have a link. Are you saying all cars with DP's need a back end flash? For what? I don't suppose you going to answer that

 

[Acheron]

Ok let me break this down. You aren't answering my question & I know why.

So what happens when you remove the primary catts? And what tuning is required?

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Sherwin, who made the blanket statement you're referring to and please link me to it?

Terry made it. I don't have a link. Are you saying all cars with DP's need a back end flash? For what? I don't suppose you going to answer that

---

This is now the 3rd time I'm saying this: Terry made that statement in reference to one version of the backend flash. It was not a blanket statement. If you can provide a link stating otherwise we can continue down this path, but I'm not going to repeat this a 4th time.

I've never stated that cars with dp need a backend flash. I've said that ALL JB'ed cars (even those without any hardware mods) can benefit from the BMS backend flash. My point has been and still is that running a comparison of standalone tune versus standalone JB became pointless once the backend flashes became available.

 

[hoosain]

car with dp and jb4 makes power
but car with dp + jb4 +E85 backend flash and 40% eth like you guys are using should yield a very similar result

 

[Sherwin@xcede]

I've never stated that cars with dp need a backend flash. I've said that ALL JB'ed cars (even those without any hardware mods) can benefit from the BMS backend flash. My point has been and still is that running a comparison of standalone tune versus standalone JB became pointless once the backend flashes became available.

Ok then we on the same page as you don't need it.

And no a comparison for horsepower is not pointless. The back end flash won't add hp for a car with DP's. This thread is about a dyno comparison.

 

[dvst8]

Okay, enough internet argueing. Lets get to a dyno and test this.

I will sponsor the beers, coffee, milkshake after.

:coolShake

 

[Sherwin@xcede]

car with dp and jb4 makes power
but car with dp + jb4 +E85 backend flash and 40% eth like you guys are using should yield a very similar result

No it won't. Bring a car and prove it.

 

[ChefDJ]

Okay, enough internet argueing. Lets get to a dyno and test this.

I will sponsor the beers, coffee, milkshake after.

:coolShake

In for MILKSHAKE!

 

[$nivz330d$]

Okay, enough internet argueing. Lets get to a dyno and test this.

I will sponsor the beers, coffee, milkshake after.

:coolShake

In for MILKSHAKE!

i want the beers please.....:ty:

 

[Acheron]

I've never stated that cars with dp need a backend flash. I've said that ALL JB'ed cars (even those without any hardware mods) can benefit from the BMS backend flash. My point has been and still is that running a comparison of standalone tune versus standalone JB became pointless once the backend flashes became available.

Ok then we on the same page as you don't need it.

And no a comparison for horsepower is not pointless. The back end flash won't add hp for a car with DP's. This thread is about a dyno comparison.

This statement alone is all the proof I need that you don't actually know what the backend flash is for. Hint: It has nothing to do with dp's.

Out of interest are you willing to post data logs of the runs here? I've always found dyno charts are fairly meaningless without logs to contextualize them.

 

[Sherwin@xcede]

This statement alone is all the proof I need that you don't actually know what the backend flash is for. Hint: It has nothing to do with dp's.

Jesus Christ! I just said it is not needed to make horsepower with DP's. Of course I know what a back end flash is for. I said it doesn't add horsepower for a car with DPs.

Can you answer my question or not? What tuning does the back end flash add specific to catless downpipes. By the way, I know the answer.

---

I've never stated that cars with dp need a backend flash. I've said that ALL JB'ed cars (even those without any hardware mods) can benefit from the BMS backend flash. My point has been and still is that running a comparison of standalone tune versus standalone JB became pointless once the backend flashes became available.

Ok then we on the same page as you don't need it.

And no a comparison for horsepower is not pointless. The back end flash won't add hp for a car with DP's. This thread is about a dyno comparison.

This statement alone is all the proof I need that you don't actually know what the backend flash is for. Hint: It has nothing to do with dp's.

Are you actually saying you need the back end flash to add horsepower for a car with DP's? PLease make up your mind.

 

[4PipeR]

Hey guys , I have a JB4/Backend Flash on my 135i. I don't mind bringing it to the dyno to test that and Xcedes file on the car.

 

[hoosain]

neesh aka 4piper did 281.7kw and 647nm on kar dyno with dp and jb4 PUMP flash +NF
13 flat 1/4 mile and 246kph on km

SO with e85 flash which is targeting higher timing and leaner afr i see no reason why it shouldnt yield similar results to your flash

 

[Arbee]

Okay, enough internet argueing. Lets get to a dyno and test this.

I will sponsor the beers, coffee, milkshake after.

:coolShake

Or better yet, take it to the 'track'...

Oh wait, Xcede has done this already at Hillfox (granted its not a track but its where fairy tales became a reality!)

 

[Rommies]

Hey guys , I have a JB4/Backend Flash on my 135i. I don't mind bringing it to the dyno to test that and Xcedes file on the car.

+1 great idea.

 

[Acheron]

This statement alone is all the proof I need that you don't actually know what the backend flash is for. Hint: It has nothing to do with dp's.

Jesus Christ! I just said it is not needed to make horsepower with DP's. Of course I know what a back end flash is for. I said it doesn't add horsepower for a car with DPs.

Can you answer my question or not? What tuning does the back end flash add specific to catless downpipes. By the way, I know the answer.

---

I've never stated that cars with dp need a backend flash. I've said that ALL JB'ed cars (even those without any hardware mods) can benefit from the BMS backend flash. My point has been and still is that running a comparison of standalone tune versus standalone JB became pointless once the backend flashes became available.

Ok then we on the same page as you don't need it.

And no a comparison for horsepower is not pointless. The back end flash won't add hp for a car with DP's. This thread is about a dyno comparison.

This statement alone is all the proof I need that you don't actually know what the backend flash is for. Hint: It has nothing to do with dp's.

Are you actually saying you need the back end flash to add horsepower for a car with DP's? PLease make up your mind.

---

Mate, you're the only one thus far that has claimed any relation between the backend flash and DP's. I've consistently told you that they do not factor into whether the BMS backend flash can or should be used.

The backend flash is never required, it is optional should you choose to get more out of your car (regardless of hardware). This is true for those with or without downpipes.

By all means, clarify what you think these backend flashes do.

 

[$nivz330d$]

vaar8..... i must say your ll oz are very naaring oz.....:tiptoe:

 

[Kish2604]

Kish, you make 323kw on the wheels and this is what you run:

02/11/2014 12:58:02 PM Right 6B27, 12.498 187.08 0.731 NO 2.0004

I don't know if you understand drag racing & the significance of exit speed in relation to horsepower. But first want to confirm the above. I's sure you are going to say that there was something wrong with the car, please don't use the driver as the excuse because I am going to delve into the exit speed not the ET.
[/quote]

02/11/2014 02:54:5L4e fPt M 6B22, A JP OTTE 12.365 186.93 0.907 NO 2.089
so Sherwin, you ignored my question previously but I will ask it again, what does power have to do with my exit speed?

this results highlighted above is from a 135i with RB turbos making at least 50-75 more kw than me but we exit the same speed give or take a km or 2... shouldn't he be exiting at 200kmh plus based on the power? and as YOU said no excuses about the driver, weather, etc... both results from the same day and event...