BMW Picking up P&P

[TurboLlew]

M4 with Motorplan Cancelled due to being chipped. Sure there is wiggle room to negotiate in there as well for someone looking for such a project... 7000km! I checked and plan cannot be reinstated apparently.

http://www.autotrader.co.za/used-cars/bmw/m4/2015-bmw-m4-auto--fpa-09c2159682fa4c5cae202c6278702dfa

 

[TurboLlew]

M4 with Motorplan Cancelled due to being chipped. Sure there is wiggle room to negotiate in there as well for someone looking for such a project... 7000km! I checked and plan cannot be reinstated apparently.

Oh wow, that's gotta hurt!

+1 ouch

But why sell it after getting caught, you already lost money at this point. Go ahead and play big, why stop there?

I'd have done that. Then again I imagine many people won't want to go big without BMW there to pick up the repair bill... or simply wouldn't be able to cover the costs of repairs without plan (reality is that many folks in these cars can't afford them in the first place without massive residuals and the motorplan). Not the only M4 around without plan.

May also simply be bad taste in the mouth after the whole experience and he wanted to get *something* out of it while he still could. Imagine having a car with no plan. You owe maybe 1 bar on it, then something major happens: the motor breaks catastrophically and costs you R300K or gearbox goes and it is R200K. Motors and boxes are not exactly easily available used. At that point, you are sitting with a million rand paperweight. You drop R300K fixing it (assuming you find it somehow) and you still have a R650/700K car that you owe a million rand on with no motorplan. Not many would have the appetite. Different story if you owned the car outright already and you have free cash to play with.

 

[babyboss]

M4 with Motorplan Cancelled due to being chipped. Sure there is wiggle room to negotiate in there as well for someone looking for such a project... 7000km! I checked and plan cannot be reinstated apparently.

Oh wow, that's gotta hurt!

+1 ouch

But why sell it after getting caught, you already lost money at this point. Go ahead and play big, why stop there?

I'd have done that. Then again I imagine many people won't want to go big without BMW there to pick up the repair bill... or simply wouldn't be able to cover the costs of repairs without plan (reality is that many folks in these cars can't afford them in the first place without massive residuals and the motorplan). Not the only M4 around without plan.

May also simply be bad taste in the mouth after the whole experience and he wanted to get *something* out of it while he still could. Imagine having a car with no plan. You owe maybe 1 bar on it, then something major happens: the motor breaks catastrophically and costs you R300K or gearbox goes and it is R200K. Motors and boxes are not exactly easily available used. At that point, you are sitting with a million rand paperweight. You drop R300K fixing it (assuming you find it somehow) and you still have a R650/700K car that you owe a million rand on with no motorplan. Not many would have the appetite. Different story if you owned the car outright already and you have free cash to play with.

Would be informative to find out How Bmw picked up on Chip

 

[TurboLlew]

Would be informative to find out How Bmw picked up on Chip

Definitely! It isn't the first new-gen M car I've heard of with a cancelled plan...

 

[MikeR]

Would be informative to find out How Bmw picked up on Chip

Definitely! It isn't the first new-gen M car I've heard of with a cancelled plan...

They have been doing it for years, Ive mentioned it before and Ive been shot down. A family member is a BMW Workshop manager and he tells me they find it every time. The workshops let some slide but when Motorplan guys them self check - its out the door. Dont for one second think they are fools - they have the technology to pick up on chips even the piggy back ones.
Its not only BMW the others do it also.
:blueCry:

 

[Major]

BMW have been using FlexRay since 2006 or so, looks like they're really starting to clamp down with it on these new cars. Steve Dinan explains:

If piggybacks don't accommodate for all of these 'traps', BMW can find out. They know what and how these piggyback manufacturers operate. You don't think BMW can go as far as using other body modules to 'double-check' what's happening elsewhere?

 

[TurboLlew]

Would be informative to find out How Bmw picked up on Chip

Definitely! It isn't the first new-gen M car I've heard of with a cancelled plan...

They have been doing it for years, Ive mentioned it before and Ive been shot down. A family member is a BMW Workshop manager and he tells me they find it every time. The workshops let some slide but when Motorplan guys them self check - its out the door. Dont for one second think they are fools - they have the technology to pick up on chips even the piggy back ones.
Its not only BMW the others do it also.
:blueCry:

Lots of theories around motorplan fraud (which is essentially what it is) and dealers closing down as well as what the new cars actually track and report. There are multiple layers of encryption in the electronics' software/firmware, one layer of which has only recently been cracked after years, and data is collected every time the car is at the dealer. The DCT transmission control unit also apparently counts launches, monitors torque and counts teeth to monitor wheelspin... where this is stored and how it is reported is anyone's guess...

VW has clamped down in a big way not only checking ECU but all other modules in the cars as well. Actually all the other manufacturers are doing this as well albeit to a lesser degree. Renault SA and Subaru SA in particular are now detecting previously 'undetectable' mods and voiding warranties. A tell-tale sign is apparently when a car comes in with a serious drivetrain issue/failure and there are magically no codes recorded. There is also carelessness or laziness... dude with an M6 apparently left his boost control module in the car and BMW found it (hearsay, but that's the story doing the rounds - personally I can't see how you would take that chance when trying to get a R400K motor replaced...).

My big concern stopping me from doing PnP despite all the deals that have come up recently has always been a failure away from a 'friendly' dealer or inspection by BMW. I've been at a dealer when they come to inspect and the staff are almost literally quaking in their boots... Difficult for your contact to save you in that situation even if you have one. No dealer is going to trade his business/franchise for protecting 1 client and employee.

All tuners state that 'BMW has to prove it is the JB/RC/etc that caused the failure' and that it is a risk that you take at the end of the day. The guys who shoot you down next time need to probably also give experience on what happens if the car goes in for more than routine or common failures... I also suspect it is like many other communities where nobody hears about cars breaking and nobody hears when warranties are voided etc. As soon as someone speaks up, they are the 'only ones' affected and it turns into a 50-pager thread... Perhaps a topic worthy of a thread of it's own

 

[Kimeran]

I have a friend that works for PFK, they have a hand in building the ECUs for some manufacturers.

He said they are working with Toyota to develop a system that alerts Toyota whenever your car throws a fault.
Apparently BMW have something similar as well.

They say they do it to decrease response time, but we all know they are trying to watch what you do with your car

 

[Sabretooth tiger]

Hence I always say, if you cant afford to loose your MP, leave the car stock. No way Manufacturers will in this day and age not have developed a way to pick it up.

Some folks are lucky, and don't get caught, but you might end up being the unlucky one, and end up shafting yourself.

 

[KarshS]

theres ways to get passed this and its easy.....Rather not say it publicly :rollsmile:

 

[Sabretooth tiger]

I also heard BMW has to prove it (stated by some Tuners). I have however read a case where BMW simply showed the owner the finger, they told him car had after market software on, but was flashed back to stock, and that car was revved outside the stock parameters. He ended up having to prove the car was NOT tuned. The story went dead, and the owner never gave an update again after people asked him to.

I also know of a case, where a guy took his car in for a service, car had aftermarket exhaust on, was idling, Motorplan guys walked in, looked under the car, and asked for the front bumper to be removed, and they found his water meth kit. bye bye his motorplan went.

 

[ChefDJ]

I also heard BMW has to prove it (stated by some Tuners). I have however read a case where BMW simply showed the owner the finger, they told him car had after market software on, but was flashed back to stock, and that car was revved outside the stock parameters. He ended up having to prove the car was NOT tuned. The story went dead, and the owner never gave an update again after people asked him to.

I also know of a case, where a guy took his car in for a service, car had aftermarket exhaust on, was idling, Motorplan guys walked in, looked under the car, and asked for the front bumper to be removed, and they found his water meth kit. bye bye his motorplan went.

This was posted here on the forum, was it not? A member? :thinking:

 

[Sabretooth tiger]

I also heard BMW has to prove it (stated by some Tuners). I have however read a case where BMW simply showed the owner the finger, they told him car had after market software on, but was flashed back to stock, and that car was revved outside the stock parameters. He ended up having to prove the car was NOT tuned. The story went dead, and the owner never gave an update again after people asked him to.

I also know of a case, where a guy took his car in for a service, car had aftermarket exhaust on, was idling, Motorplan guys walked in, looked under the car, and asked for the front bumper to be removed, and they found his water meth kit. bye bye his motorplan went.

This was posted here on the forum, was it not? A member? :thinking:

Both cases yes.

 

[KarshS]

I also know of a case, where a guy took his car in for a service, car had aftermarket exhaust on, was idling, Motorplan guys walked in, looked under the car, and asked for the front bumper to be removed, and they found his water meth kit. bye bye his motorplan went.

This guy was asking for it then :biglol:

 

[Igniter]

ouch

 

[Sabretooth tiger]

I also know of a case, where a guy took his car in for a service, car had aftermarket exhaust on, was idling, Motorplan guys walked in, looked under the car, and asked for the front bumper to be removed, and they found his water meth kit. bye bye his motorplan went.

This guy was asking for it then :biglol:

No doubt he was, but it could have been a"friendly" dealership, but on that fate full day the MP's (Motorplan Police) walked in.

 

[KarshS]

I also know of a case, where a guy took his car in for a service, car had aftermarket exhaust on, was idling, Motorplan guys walked in, looked under the car, and asked for the front bumper to be removed, and they found his water meth kit. bye bye his motorplan went.

This guy was asking for it then :biglol:

No doubt he was, but it could have been a"friendly" dealership, but on that fate full day the MP's (Motorplan Police) walked in.

The same friendly dealership will tell you. I will take your car in with the mods....But if BMW comes here and inspects his job is more important than protecting your motorplan.

Mod your car with the knowing that you might/will be caught and when your motorplan is cancelled you can laugh about it and not cry.

 

[TurboLlew]

I also know of a case, where a guy took his car in for a service, car had aftermarket exhaust on, was idling, Motorplan guys walked in, looked under the car, and asked for the front bumper to be removed, and they found his water meth kit. bye bye his motorplan went.

This guy was asking for it then :biglol:

No doubt he was, but it could have been a"friendly" dealership, but on that fate full day the MP's (Motorplan Police) walked in.

The thing is, there is a false sense of security with these 'friendly' dealers since a lot of the time it is reliant on a few people in the workshop. In any work environment there is also the risk of someone inside ratting out the others hence a 'co-incidental' visit by the MPs LOL.

---

Hence I always say, if you cant afford to loose your MP, leave the car stock. No way Manufacturers will in this day and age not have developed a way to pick it up.

Some folks are lucky, and don't get caught, but you might end up being the unlucky one, and end up shafting yourself.

At the end of the day this holds true

 

[Sabretooth tiger]

Mod your car with the knowing that you might/will be caught and when your motorplan is cancelled you can laugh about it and not cry.

My sentiments exactly. If you cant afford to loose your MP, and fit the bill yourself in the event of a breakdown, simply leave the car stock, or save yourself the money in the beginning and buy one out of plan, and use the difference in purchase price as your own "Motorplan"

 

[ChefDJ]

Touching on what others have said before... Is a dealership at risk of losing its business if it performs services on vehicles which are modded but on motorplan, and fails to report it or whatever?