Maintenance for Jeff's M5

[Frany]

Oil & filter changed.
A HUGE thanks to Mike - he dropped off 10 litres of Mobil1 which he kept for me for ages, awesome dude - really, really appreciate it.

Righto's, so after getting messy and changing out the oil I could finally drive the car properly. Here's what I've noticed though.... I can't seem to figure out what's wrong.

CPS, Vanos, Vanos Seals, DSC, Diff, Plugs. I'm a little lost.
Once the car is warmed up and at running temp, whenever I accelerate hard under 4000rpm the car bogs down. The rev's go up but the car doesn't go anywhere. Anything above 4000rpm things are fine and she's pulling like a demon.

I've done a fair amount of reading up and symptoms for the Vanos Seals almost fit this perfectly - except for difficult pull off's in 1st gear. So with that said, I'm leaning towards replacing the Vanos Seals. BUT - intermittently, the car will jerk in 2nd gear. Hard or soft accelerations, 2nd gear seems to make the car jump until I either change gears or put the clutch in - CPS maybe?

Suggestions are appreciated guys! Would like to do as much with DIY. Probably just a good idea to change the plugs anyway.

Check your cats if uve stil got them also exhaust sensors and if u plug the MAF's out does it runn better ? Try 1 for 1 then both. If yes then either a leak behind the maf close to the moter or maf are shot. Easy way to check for leaks is spry carb cleaner on pypes gnd mear injectors and intake ports near the head if idle changes uve got a leak. Hope that helps

 

[jeff_denning]

OK, so I'm not sure if this is just wishful thinking - but could this possibly be a vanos issue and not clutch related?
I've described the issues a page before, what ways can I test to pin-point the problems to clutch?

If it is slipping, wouldn't it slip out of gear too? Also, the higher RPM's are 100% and pulling like a demon.

I found symptoms for Vanos here:

Cars experience:
Overall loss of torque and power, particularly in the lower RPM range, < 3k. Bogging then surging at 3k RPM. Uneven power distribution and RPM transition. Engine hesitations in the lower RPM range, < 3k. Louder idle and intermittent idle RPM hiccups. Difficult takeoffs. Loss of power and bogging when AC on. Increased fuel consumption.
Repairing the vanos seals provides:
Overall increase in torque and power, particularly in the lower RPM range, < 3k. Resolution of bogging then surging at 3k RPM. Smooth even distribution of power and RPM transition. Resolution of engine hesitations in the lower RPM range, < 3k. Quiet stable idle. Smooth easy takeoffs. Improved performance when AC on. Reduced fuel consumption, by ~10%.

Any thoughts?

 

[Nic_s]

It won't slip out of gear. If that happens then it's a problem with the gearbox itself.

More or less at what position of the clutch pedal does the clutch take? Close to the top?

WRT your power issue, it sounds like it could very well be Vanos. Did you let someone check the software? Diagnostics? Do know what work if any was done to the vanos and when last was it done? Can you see anything if you pull all the motorplan data at BMW?

Sorry if this was asked before, I didn't follow every post :uhoh:

 

[Mamba]

When my cars clutch went I could here the engine rev up but did not pick up speed, it deteriorated very fast after that to such an extend that I could not get it in gear any more.

Here is an explenation of how the vanos work:

http://www.bmwfanatics.co.za/showthread.php?tid=18176&highlight=vanos

 

[jeff_denning]

It won't slip out of gear. If that happens then it's a problem with the gearbox itself.

More or less at what position of the clutch pedal does the clutch take? Close to the top?

WRT your power issue, it sounds like it could very well be Vanos. Did you let someone check the software? Diagnostics? Do know what work if any was done to the vanos and when last was it done? Can you see anything if you pull all the motorplan data at BMW?

Sorry if this was asked before, I didn't follow every post :uhoh:

Thanks for the reply dude, appreciated!
Clutch doesn't seem to have change from what I can tell, takes fine, down shifts are fine. I tried a hard start, from stand still and she took off like a demon, back wheels spinning and all...

The odd loss of power only ever comes in when I'm driving at lower RPM. There is a bit of pull, but the real torque only really drops once the revs have dropped back down.

No known work done on the Vanos, running a UniQ chip along with the stage 1 RGM conversion.

 

[Nic_s]

Is it getting worse? Was it like this when you bought it? Did you have it connected to any diagnostics? Diagnostics should tell if it's the Vanos, I think :mmm:

Go to a BMW dealer, give them you vin, and let them print out all the motorplan data. I did that and found some interesting things like my gearbox was replaced just after 6000km, but more importantly it showed me what was and wasn't done to the car.

 

[jeff_denning]

Is it getting worse? Was it like this when you bought it? Did you have it connected to any diagnostics? Diagnostics should tell if it's the Vanos, I think :mmm:

Go to a BMW dealer, give them you vin, and let them print out all the motorplan data. I did that and found some interesting things like my gearbox was replaced just after 6000km, but more importantly it showed me what was and wasn't done to the car.

Hasn't gotten worse, still the same 'ol bog down on power that seemed to have just crept up and stayed there.
My diagnostics don't show errors, Mike was going to pull in and check his side but we haven't got around to doing it just yet.

Will have a chat to the guys at BMW and pull the motorplan data, could be useful
Push comes to shove, I'll take it into SMG this week sometime and tell them to fix whatever is broken.

 

[Nic_s]

Is it getting worse? Was it like this when you bought it? Did you have it connected to any diagnostics? Diagnostics should tell if it's the Vanos, I think :mmm:

Go to a BMW dealer, give them you vin, and let them print out all the motorplan data. I did that and found some interesting things like my gearbox was replaced just after 6000km, but more importantly it showed me what was and wasn't done to the car.

Hasn't gotten worse, still the same 'ol bog down on power that seemed to have just crept up and stayed there.
My diagnostics don't show errors, Mike was going to pull in and check his side but we haven't got around to doing it just yet.

Will have a chat to the guys at BMW and pull the motorplan data, could be useful
Push comes to shove, I'll take it into SMG this week sometime and tell them to fix whatever is broken.

Well, it does sound kinda Vanos related. I'm no expert on the matter though :dunno:
But maybe you can see if they have done any work on the Vanos and at what km while the car was still under motorplan if you get a print out. :thumb:

 

[jeff_denning]

Car's at SMG now having the clutch replaced.
On top of that, they found the prop shaft couplings and rear stabliser bushes are both broken :argh:

Any estimates on pricing on these two parts?

Sith... I'll swap something for your couplings :bravo:

 

[jeff_denning]

And my flywheel is stuffed.

Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

 

[Nic_s]

That sucks. Just do what I do... take comfort in the fact that it will all be new and that it will add to your peace of mind.

Keep us posted.

 

[jeff_denning]

That sucks. Just do what I do... take comfort in the fact that it will all be new and that it will add to your peace of mind.

Keep us posted.

The R28k quote from SMG isn't too comforting though Just moved, can't afford anywhere near that.
So far, they say the following is wrong:

Flywheel
Clutch (already paid for)
Propshaft coupling. Universal joint
Rear suspension bushings

The flywheel alone is R17k from SMG. FML, seriously!

 

[pi328]

For second opinion on the propshaft issues: Propshaft Engineering Cape in Elsiesriver: 021-5922241. Speak to Colin and tell him I referred you to him.

[Edit]And maybe this would help? http://capetown-westerncape.gumtree...ment-parts-bmw-m5-flywheel-W0QQAdIdZ371819770

 

[WyKiD]

Would it not have been an option to send the car to a good non-dealership workshop?

 

[Jandre]

Was just going to inform you about the gumtree add that PI328 just posted.

 

[moranor@axis]

why you taking the car to the dealer?

 

[jeff_denning]

Thanks for all the comments guys, appreciated!
My main concern at the moment is getting the fly-wheel done. Can always get the bushings and couplings sorted out at the end of the month.

Main issue here is, even not at a stealer - I just dropped a bucket of cash on rent, deposit and moving house.
I've gone to SMG because I have an excellent relationship with them, and I've had nothing but exceptional service - so I really don't mind paying a little extra.

As I mention above, if I can get a flywheel I'll do that now and limp the car around until the end of the month and then get the couplings and bushings sorted.

Only other option is to start selling my shit and see what comes of that :thumbdo:

 

[moranor@axis]

R17k for a flywheel is not a little more its alot...

 

[Nic_s]

That sucks. Just do what I do... take comfort in the fact that it will all be new and that it will add to your peace of mind.

Keep us posted.

The R28k quote from SMG isn't too comforting though Just moved, can't afford anywhere near that.
So far, they say the following is wrong:

Flywheel
Clutch (already paid for)
Propshaft coupling. Universal joint
Rear suspension bushings

The flywheel alone is R17k from SMG. FML, seriously!

What?? R17k for a flywheel??

Have a look at this link:
http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e39-m5-e52-z8-discussion/196392-e39-m5-oem-clutch-flywheel-luk.html


According to that, I would import the LUK parts. I mean £223.45 + vat (Roughly R2800) is so much better than R17k.



Or see here (Roughly R5400 for the LUK part):
http://www.ecstuning.com/Search/21212229190/

EDIT: I used the part number from realOEM.

I know it's clearly cheaper from the UK, but I don't know what it's like to import from there. I got my clutch kit for about R5500 + shipping (Which was R9k local) from ECS with no issues. The box even had BMW branding on it :thumb:

 

[jeff_denning]

Agreed that R17k is insane for a flywheel. I'm trying to source one locally now.
Once that's sorted, I'll do the rest month after month - along with selling a few of my belongings