F30 320i Xcedes World Record?

Fuzz@tinyNET

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skank said:
Ok, so Johannesburg at 1700m has 825hPa of air pressure.
Sea level has an average 1013hPa of pressure so that dicates that in Johannesburg you have 825/1013=0.8144 or 81.44% of sea level pressure. Following me here?

This drop in pressure means a NA engine in Johannesburg will have ~81.44% of the power it has at sea level.

A 125kw NA car will have no more than 101.77kw at the flywheel whilst in Johannesburg. A difference of 18.56%.

Now obviously these figures are for an NA engine not FI. FI ECUs will compensate for the thinner
air by increasing the boost to a degree but cannot cope with the absolute pressure completely so
will still be a couple % lower but not as much as the 18.58% for an NA engine.

This begs my question, why the 30% correction on the dyno?


I quote from Borg Warner

"The high-altitude performance of a turbocharged engine is significantly better. Because of the lower air pressure at high altitudes, the power loss of a naturally aspirated engine is considerable. In contrast, the performance of the turbine improves at altitude as a result of the greater pressure difference between the virtually constant pressure upstream of the turbine and the lower ambient pressure at outlet. The lower air density at the compressor inlet is largely equalized. Hence, the engine has barely any power loss."

Moving on:

As ambient correction entails the following :

1) Ambient Pressure
2) Ambient Temperature
3) Relative Humidity

And we know that Pressure correction should not be more than ~18% up here for NA, that leaves Temperature and Humidity.

Temperature needs to be adjusted to 25 degrees Celcius and will have an effect on performance but not nearly as much as Pressure.
Considering the mild Johannesburg climate recently to meet the SAE standard you'd almost have to be lowering the Temperature correction. In this regard a 10 degree celcius change with have ~3% influence on power. So let's say an average Temperature pf 25 degress celcius in Johannesburg, that equates to 0% ambient correction. 30 degrees? A 1% difference.

Humidity is the least effective on power, an increase in 20% relative humidity will equate to less than 1% power difference. The humidity in Joburg ranges from 47% to 60% a correction difference of
~1%. The SAE Standard dicates correction to 0% Humidity, so let's do that. Today's Humidity is 56%, that equates to 2% Ambient Correction.

So Today in Johannesburg any Dyno doing a power run should have adjusted to 20.58% Ambient Correction for NA engined cars. This is a Correction Factor of 1.267.
Ambient Correction for a Dyno needs to be adjusted constantly to get consistent results.
Now, as I understand it, and I'm open to correction, for Turbo applications we need to add the absolute manifold pressure into the equation to cater for Ambient Correction. Remember the higher the boost the lower the effect of altitude. Assuming no efficiency changes in the Turbo due to altitude, which we know is not the case, let's add 20PSI in the case of a Turbo. 20PSI is 1380hPa.

So 1380hPa + 1013hPa becomes 2393hPa absolute manifold pressure for Sea Level.
And 1380hPa + 825hPa becomes 2205hPa AMP for Joburg.

That becomes a Correction Factor of 2393/2205 = 1.085

Therefore the NA CF of 1.236/1.085 = 1.160 or a 16% OVER READ of the power using a realistic NA AC of 20.58%.

By my calculations the Ambient Correction for the Turbo 320i @20PSI should be 8%

Where does the 30% set Ambient Correction come from? Because today if you did a power run at 30% that Dyno would be over reading by 31.7%

Have I missed something here?

This has been addressed in another thread - let's not derail this thread with how dyno operators run their dynos :thumbs:
http://www.bmwfanatics.co.za/showthread.php?tid=62222






Alex (DieselFan), while resale value, etc is of importance, I don't think that discussion holds merit here when this thread has been created to congratulate the figures that are being generated by this car. As a mod, you should be sensitive to this. That all being said, if you'd like to discuss the resale value of modified cars, you're welcome to create a thread for this purpose so as not to clutter this thread.


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Fuzz@tinyNET

///Member
Official Advertiser
333wez said:
I wonder how promotec + Deep Penetration will affect resale value??

Let's play nice, Promotec has been dissolved a while back.

Guys, please refrain from flaming, or I will unapprove the thread :thumbs:


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Blert

///Member
comments_5186958122.png
 

gerald5ive

Member
Fuzz@TheDynamikProject said:
skank said:
Ok, so Johannesburg at 1700m has 825hPa of air pressure.
Sea level has an average 1013hPa of pressure so that dicates that in Johannesburg you have 825/1013=0.8144 or 81.44% of sea level pressure. ..........
Have I missed something here?

This has been addressed in another thread - let's not derail this thread with how dyno operators run their dynos :thumbs:
http://www.bmwfanatics.co.za/showthread.php?tid=62222

I disagree Fuzz. This thread is about the power that this tuner can make out of a 320i. If the dyno is not calibrated correctly the the power can be over or under stated. This would mean that the claim in post 1 of the vehicles power is questionable.
 

Fuzz@tinyNET

///Member
Official Advertiser
gerald5ive said:
Fuzz@TheDynamikProject said:
skank said:
Ok, so Johannesburg at 1700m has 825hPa of air pressure.
Sea level has an average 1013hPa of pressure so that dicates that in Johannesburg you have 825/1013=0.8144 or 81.44% of sea level pressure. ..........
Have I missed something here?

This has been addressed in another thread - let's not derail this thread with how dyno operators run their dynos :thumbs:
http://www.bmwfanatics.co.za/showthread.php?tid=62222

I disagree Fuzz. This thread is about the power that this tuner can make out of a 320i. If the dyno is not calibrated correctly the the power can be over or under stated. This would mean that the claim in post 1 of the vehicles power is questionable.

Hi Gerald,

Please discuss this on the thread that his been linked in my previous reply :cartel:
 

Kimeran

///Member
Yeah but what's the point of having 2 threads discussing the same thing?
To the owner of the car....well flippen done!!
Screw dyno numbers, I got to see this car run, and trust me...IT RUNS!!! :clapper: :praise:
 

Gizmo

Banned
That is a different topic about sea-reef dyno outputs, this thread is about a world record 320i, OP chose to make 2 separate threads and spill the same info across both so the conversations are spilling over both, let it run its course.
 

Arbee

Honorary ///Member
Kimeran said:
Yeah but what's the point of having 2 threads discussing the same thing?
To the owner of the car....well flippen done!!
Screw dyno numbers, I got to see this car run, and trust me...IT RUNS!!! :clapper: :praise:

That is what matters...

/thread
 

KarshS

///Member
Cant we all just get along :=):

by some comments i feel people should have some respect towards members on this forum.

Xcede is a forum advertiser and Sherwin is willing to share his accomplishments and wisdom with us all.
Like all of us we are not perfect and we do not know it all but learn from others.

I for one have utmost respect to the Xcede guys, although i may have another tuner, the xcede guys are always willing to help and share knowledge, be it on the track or a social.

I believe that if we all respect each other and take things with a pinch of salt this thread would have not swing in this direction.
I know more than you bla bla bla, its the same people who want to have a dick swing contest.

Like i said before this car is simply awesome and i would be proud to drive under the xcede banner knowing its a monster....
 

KarshS

///Member
Sabretooth tiger said:
You okes realize there is like 2-3 woman ratio to each guy, and that's way more fun than a internet measuring contest?

Thats in the Cape.....Mostly GP ous commenting here... Shows....
 
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