No, you guys have missed my point by a mile and a half. :nonono:
My question is not which is a better car, comes with better discount, finance packages or different engines it is about value - What value does a 320i offer as apposed to its competitors. At the end of the day everything aside.
My father was offered a 320i for R380 000 with very little going for it, the Mercedes is a diesel with twice the power and half the fuel consumption and has more toys than Santa Klaus at Christmas.
Both cars would cost him R380 000 irrespective of what was offered. It is plainly obvious that the Mercedes Benz offers far greater value to that of the BMW. Even the biggest of the BMW Fans can see this.
Prospect and Mike, do us all a favour and please read the thread. All your questions are answered in earlier posts.
Mate, do us a favour and go with it. If this thread upsets you, then dont read it. Like with all discussions there are various opinions and beliefs that must be taken into consideration. There is no need for you to throw your toys out the cot because question the car you drive.
1. The 320i is n/a petrol and you comparing to a diesel. There can be no basis for comparison.
No, there is a basis for comparison because my questions and intend of my comparison are with regards to the "value" associated with two different kinds of brands & vehicles with the given scenario.
Which motor would you rather have? A breathless petrol motor or a torquey fuel efficient diesel with loads of oomph? The diesel motor in the Mercedes Benz offers far greater value than the motor in the BMW.
2. Your exclusion for the bmw were not on par with the merc remeber that Avantgarde, satnav, heated seats etc are all free extras merc offers to compete with the assistance packages BMW offers so if you want to compare without incentives as you mentioned then you should exclude the merc ones as well.
Irrespective of trade assistance, discount etc. The scenario was that my father had R380 000 cash to spend on a car. BMW offered a lesser vehicle to that of which Mercedes offered. There is no exclusions. The Mercedes once again offers twice the value for money as apposed to the BMW offered at the same price. If the Mercedes Benz comes with a higher trim level standard then that is a definitive perk to buying a Mercedes. The BMW still loses.
A base 320i is about 330k. Currently you can get around 70k off if you can haggle. That's 260k for a full house family car with a good motorplan, decent driving dynamics and well engineered. Currently you pay more for a Hyundai Sonata! For the 320i target market this is unbeatable. No other manufacturer can compete at the moment. People don't want an overpriced satnav and heated seats. They want value.
This is exactly the point you are missing. Given the above scenario the BMW offers nothing that the Mercedes Benz cannot.
Yes, I agree that a standard 320i at R330 000 is good value considering the discounts etc offered, but the C180 Blue Efficiency coming in with a 2 Litre Petrol and similar power costs only R20 000 more and comes with more standard, a better motorplan, a turbo charged engine as well as lower emissions and better fuel economy.
Even at bog standard trim levels the Mercedes Benz is still offering greater value to the client. The Audi A4 comes in at R308 000, is a current shape and with the 1.8T sporting the most power and toys out of the lot. What value does the E90 320i offer other than being a basic BMW with not much going for it?
I couldnt care less about what car you buy or live with. If you want a set of keys with a BMW logo and the 320i gives you that, then go for it and I congratulate you on joining the stable.
But on paper, and in real life the BMW sells - But for all the wrong reasons. I would sooner take an Audi or the Merc. Both are newer designs, have more toys and better engines and both offer superb value.
Also, all merc 4 pots come with artificial leather with real leather an option. How can one spend close to 400k an have what is esentially seats. A 1980 Cressida had that!
Real leather vs artificial leather... As a detailer who works with the stuff everyday - The "fake" leather in Mercs and Audi's and even VW's holds up much better than BMW leather in the current batch of cars.
Oh and another thing...
Currently you can get around 70k off if you can haggle.
This annoys me. BMW has to throw finance deals, trade assistance, trade in assistance and discount to sell a 320i. This shows me that the only way BMW can provide value is by losing value and this explains why the resale on the 320i is atrocious. There are people struggling to settle three year old 320i BMW's because the cars have lost so much value.
Once again, my scenario and my question refers to value - What can BMW offer for the R380 000 scenario I provided that another brand cannot. The answer is simple.
BMW does not provide value in a 320i.
Second hand, yes they do. As a step up from a Toyota Tazz to a 5 star safety rated Beemer yes it does. But in terms of outright value for money a brand new 320i offers nothing that any other German Saloon can.
This was my question, and I still have no answer.
question i ask,why do people buy a mini?
ive sat in one and with the seat in its futherest position,im still cramped(only the countryman has enough space)there is no space in the back for my son,and you cant go on holiday with it,the standard one isway underpowered.
but before you climb down my throat,you see them everywhere,they are cute.but i would rather buy either a second hand 320i or a 1 series
Easy answer. Nothing compares to a MINI.
MINI offers three main perks to its clients.
1. An individual driving experience - No MINI is the same.
2. An exciting driving experience - MINI is fun, sporty and enthusiastic.
3. The MINI experience.
There is no competitor in the market that offers the three things I listed above. Fiat, Citroen and many others have tried and failed. With the exception of the Cooper Countryman (The 320i of the MINI range) the basic Cooper motor offers 90kw in a light body. The 1.6 Cooper will make a 320i look likes its looking for parking.
MINI is fun, personalized and offers a ownership experience that no other brand offers. You have to drive a MINI to understand - People will pay mad amounts of money for a MINI because it offers value that they cannot find anywhere else. If it were not for the image, driving experience and looks of the MINI it would be nothing - Much like the Fiat 500.
Its the MINI experience that makes people buy MINI. Visit Auto Atlantic is talk to Janice, Mbali or even Nathan and you will understand why people buy these cars. I did sales for MINI for over a year and traded in many a BMW and Audi for MINI's because people want to be different, they want more than a car.
With a market like this MINI can charge the world and people will still buy because there is nothing you can compare a MINI to which offers the same experience. MINI adds a different kind of value to that of say Renault.
People pay for value, which is why I struggle to see the value in a car like the BMW 320i.
When comparing value (or perceived value) there are no apples to apples.
So explain why someone would see more value in a 320i as apposed to anything else?
Mike
