Which is faster 2007 330i or 2007 330d

[killua]

After going off topic (sorry) I hope my following contribution would be seen as useful. After looking up data about these very specific cars, both needing to be 2007 models, I placed them in my sim. The specs I use ar the following:
330d: 170kw, 500nm
330i: 200kw, 320nm (strangely, its more powerful than the one currently selling)

The first graph represents the acceleration of the car in each of the gears,
330d being RED
330i being BLUE

But coming to the actual question, of highway driving, lets take 2 use cases. First, both cars doing laid back driving and NOT shifting down from 6th gear. I think the normal overtaking scenario is from 80-100km.

The conclusion (which is painfully obvious) is that the diesel has a lot more torques, which gives it the edge in 6th gear.

The second scenario is where moranor is driving the 330i and shifts down to 2nd gear. Here are the acceleration graphs for 2,3 and 4th gear:

The conclusion is that the 330i will brutally kill the 330d, doesnt matter what gear the diesel is in.

These are all simulated for the coast. Here is one for the guys at the reef( same 2, 3 and 4th gear):

The conclusion is that there is a drop in performance for the 330i, but not enough for the 330d to win. The power advantage of the 330i is to big.

These results aren't the same for the new 330i vs 330d. The new 330i has 190kw, and the diesel has 180kw. These are much closer, and the diesel should be faster at the reef.

 

[moranor@axis]

lol why am i driving :rollsmile:

 

[killua]

lol why am i driving :rollsmile:

You know which gear to be in :idea:

 

[moranor@axis]

2nd is a bit short for the high way :rollsmile: but 3rd and 4th still show the results...

 

[killua]

2nd is a bit short for the high way :rollsmile: but 3rd and 4th still show the results...

Both cars in 3rd, the 330d will win. except if you want to go beyond 120km/h and have a date with Bubbu....

But thats the problem with the 330i, high revving engine for the lose if you don't drive the sh!t out of it...

 

[///MOS1TED]

"The numbers make even more sense when I take the cars around the track myself. I drive the petrol more intuitively, the throttle is easier to modulate and my gear selection more secure. If I had to choose a car for a track shootout, it would have to be the 335i"

this is why you buy a petrol... if you dont understand you may as well be an a diesel...

also finished off with that quote is :

"The 335i might still be king on the track, but on the road, for me, the 330d now rules. The King is dead. Long live the King"


Remember dude , different strokes for different folks

 

[moranor@axis]

i thought they both started at at 120kph... now i see you said 80-100kph...

at 80 its worth going down to 2nd, but at 100 3rd is better because in 2nd you will run out of rpm too quick and have to shift too soon...

---

can you post up the acceleration graph?

 

[drugekull]

Jees look at the curve in 1st and 2nd on the 330d

I wonder do they have to reinforce the driver seat in the 330d compared to the 330i

 

[Diablo Jnr]

also finished off with that quote is :

"The 335i might still be king on the track, but on the road, for me, the 330d now rules. The King is dead. Long live the King"


Remember dude , different strokes for different folks
[/quote]

As good as the 330d is and as i much as i enjoyed driving that car, I will stick with my 130i.
Diesel has loads more usable torque, but my car always puts a smile on my face and when you hear that exhaust note, words cannot describe. And dont forget the 3.0 petrol only gets going from 3rd gear, so maybe when i grow up I will get a 330d, but right now, i love my car!!!!!:thumbs:

all comes down to personal choice and and driving style.

 

[killua]

Jees look at the curve in 1st and 2nd on the 330d

I wonder do they have to reinforce the driver seat in the 330d compared to the 330i

In 1st you won't really feel the acceleration, because by the time full boost comes in, you are at the red line. 2nd gear should be more realistic...


@moranor:

acceleration from start

acceleration from 80km/h, 330i in 2nd gear and 330d in 3rd gear:

 

[moranor@axis]

these cars are pretty damn close depending on what day it is ether could win...

yes diesel had caught up to petrol in this case (there is no point in splitting hairs)

if the 330d is ever so slightly slower than the 330i how can it be = to the 335i?

 

[drugekull]

Jees look at the curve in 1st and 2nd on the 330d

I wonder do they have to reinforce the driver seat in the 330d compared to the 330i

In 1st you won't really feel the acceleration, because by the time full boost comes in, you are at the red line. 2nd gear should be more realistic...

I don't know about this Diesels are getting to full boost at 1800 rpm now days so you have a 2500 to 3000 revs of full boost and full torque before the gear changes. If you have a auto box the gear changes to second and brings the revs right in the middle of the boost so 1st and 2nd seem like one long gear. Its lovely.

 

[killua]

Jees look at the curve in 1st and 2nd on the 330d

I wonder do they have to reinforce the driver seat in the 330d compared to the 330i

In 1st you won't really feel the acceleration, because by the time full boost comes in, you are at the red line. 2nd gear should be more realistic...

I don't know about this Diesels are getting to full boost at 1800 rpm now days so you have a 2500 to 3000 revs of full boost and full torque before the gear changes. If you have a auto box the gear changes to second and brings the revs right in the middle of the boost so 1st and 2nd seem like one long gear. Its lovely.

Fair enough. I will need to do my tests first before I can run full blast into this one :fencelook:
But full torque isn't available instantly in the diesel, only when you have a load, and only after 1second (if you are way below torque peak rpm). What I have experienced is that when placing your car in 1st, and crawling along, you don't get the full acceleration when putting your foot flat. It makes a little bit of sense, because 1st gear should take 2 seconds to complete, where by the time you hit second #2, you are already at 3500rpm where the torque isn't the full figure anymore. The auto is another story, because the torque converter slips the engine to a higher RPM where spool up is much faster etc. I can't explain it, but that is what it feels like. Maybe someone could give a better explanation....

 

[Philip Foglar]

I remember reading that the 335i auto has a slight advantage of the manual simply because the engine is still under load during up shifts - turbo stays on boost whereas on the manual it drops off with your throttle control between gear changes...

:thumbs:

 

[drugekull]

Fair enough. I will need to do my tests first before I can run full blast into this one :fencelook:
But full torque isn't available instantly in the diesel, only when you have a load, and only after 1second (if you are way below torque peak rpm). What I have experienced is that when placing your car in 1st, and crawling along, you don't get the full acceleration when putting your foot flat. It makes a little bit of sense, because 1st gear should take 2 seconds to complete, where by the time you hit second #2, you are already at 3500rpm where the torque isn't the full figure anymore. The auto is another story, because the torque converter slips the engine to a higher RPM where spool up is much faster etc. I can't explain it, but that is what it feels like. Maybe someone could give a better explanation....

Actually you know I do that

When I drove manual 320d's in the past I always got put off them because of there power delivery and what you say did happen rolling start 1st was short the pull was not amazing was good but not great and when you changed to second it died a bit. But there are so many veriables did you change quick enough if you over reved the car then you will still be suffering the after effects in the next gear to get it perfect is very difficult and to tell you the truth I did not drive manual diesels enough to make it right. I also could not be bothered very messy to drive every day.

But now with my Auto I get huge amounts of pull in first actually the first few seconds are the most fun. But I actually noticed something the other day when I pull off in the auto as specially in DS mode the revs go over 1800 then it starts to engage the gear. It pulls so harshley I end up taping off a bit because I don't want to hit the traction control then once it gets going you put your foot flat second gear brings the revs right into the power really good gearing I must say it changes so fast and the pull is constant you don't even notice some times. you can actually see how close the auto is to the manual in 0 - 100 times on the specs Diesels are the only ones like this.

Auto Diesel is the only way to go. I did not like driving the manal at all.

 

[killua]

Fair enough. I will need to do my tests first before I can run full blast into this one :fencelook:
But full torque isn't available instantly in the diesel, only when you have a load, and only after 1second (if you are way below torque peak rpm). What I have experienced is that when placing your car in 1st, and crawling along, you don't get the full acceleration when putting your foot flat. It makes a little bit of sense, because 1st gear should take 2 seconds to complete, where by the time you hit second #2, you are already at 3500rpm where the torque isn't the full figure anymore. The auto is another story, because the torque converter slips the engine to a higher RPM where spool up is much faster etc. I can't explain it, but that is what it feels like. Maybe someone could give a better explanation....

Actually you know I do that

When I drove manual 320d's in the past I always got put off them because of there power delivery and what you say did happen rolling start 1st was short the pull was not amazing was good but not great and when you changed to second it died a bit. But there are so many veriables did you change quick enough if you over reved the car then you will still be suffering the after effects in the next gear to get it perfect is very difficult and to tell you the truth I did not drive manual diesels enough to make it right. I also could not be bothered very messy to drive every day.

But now with my Auto I get huge amounts of pull in first actually the first few seconds are the most fun. But I actually noticed something the other day when I pull off in the auto as specially in DS mode the revs go over 1800 then it starts to engage the gear. It pulls so harshley I end up taping off a bit because I don't want to hit the traction control then once it gets going you put your foot flat second gear brings the revs right into the power really good gearing I must say it changes so fast and the pull is constant you don't even notice some times. you can actually see how close the auto is to the manual in 0 - 100 times on the specs Diesels are the only ones like this.

Auto Diesel is the only way to go. I did not like driving the manal at all.

Ok, so it seems we agree. I do what the auto does manually. If I am rolling along in traffic and need to do a quick gettaway, I press the clutch, rev to 2000RPM and drop it, then the acceleration is instant... But I do sometimes miss my autobox, especially when I am playing taxi for the wife and kid. What I don't miss is the embarressment of little chev sparks pulling away faster than I can because I have to wait for the revs to reach 2000RPM before the clutch engages. And this has happend alot

 

[drugekull]

Fair enough. I will need to do my tests first before I can run full blast into this one :fencelook:
But full torque isn't available instantly in the diesel, only when you have a load, and only after 1second (if you are way below torque peak rpm). What I have experienced is that when placing your car in 1st, and crawling along, you don't get the full acceleration when putting your foot flat. It makes a little bit of sense, because 1st gear should take 2 seconds to complete, where by the time you hit second #2, you are already at 3500rpm where the torque isn't the full figure anymore. The auto is another story, because the torque converter slips the engine to a higher RPM where spool up is much faster etc. I can't explain it, but that is what it feels like. Maybe someone could give a better explanation....

Actually you know I do that

When I drove manual 320d's in the past I always got put off them because of there power delivery and what you say did happen rolling start 1st was short the pull was not amazing was good but not great and when you changed to second it died a bit. But there are so many veriables did you change quick enough if you over reved the car then you will still be suffering the after effects in the next gear to get it perfect is very difficult and to tell you the truth I did not drive manual diesels enough to make it right. I also could not be bothered very messy to drive every day.

But now with my Auto I get huge amounts of pull in first actually the first few seconds are the most fun. But I actually noticed something the other day when I pull off in the auto as specially in DS mode the revs go over 1800 then it starts to engage the gear. It pulls so harshley I end up taping off a bit because I don't want to hit the traction control then once it gets going you put your foot flat second gear brings the revs right into the power really good gearing I must say it changes so fast and the pull is constant you don't even notice some times. you can actually see how close the auto is to the manual in 0 - 100 times on the specs Diesels are the only ones like this.

Auto Diesel is the only way to go. I did not like driving the manal at all.

Ok, so it seems we agree. I do what the auto does manually. If I am rolling along in traffic and need to do a quick gettaway, I press the clutch, rev to 2000RPM and drop it, then the acceleration is instant... But I do sometimes miss my autobox, especially when I am playing taxi for the wife and kid. What I don't miss is the embarressment of little chev sparks pulling away faster than I can because I have to wait for the revs to reach 2000RPM before the clutch engages. And this has happend alot

Yeah in D mode it does do that I only use D on the highway never when driving in the suburbs its DS all the way the initial rev to 2000 is only on standing still pull off or when you going really slow when you coasting along you always above 2000 rpm in DS

 

[Dogland]

330d E90 Owned me in my e36 M3 robot to robot...

Yes i wasnt pushing it however since my engine was fairly cold.

 

[Iceman007]

there is one thing that beats the 330d. and that is the sound that the engine of the 330i makes

 

[///MOS1TED]

I remember reading that the 335i auto has a slight advantage of the manual simply because the engine is still under load during up shifts - turbo stays on boost whereas on the manual it drops off with your throttle control between gear changes...

:thumbs:

100% correct , Diesel is the same with the steptronic box

Also added to the topic with the E90 330d Steptronic box 60ft is faster from the line when taking off from 2nd gear as opposed to 1st gear. Vbox results show as it as well as on the track.

Some personal info I will share in seeing i hardly race my Diesel. D owners with steptronic box try this for some spirited runs engage 2nd gear ,everything off , hold a steady 1800rpm and let go as soon as robot goes green. I can promise any owner very few cars will be able to keep with the that launch technique, also remember to smile and wave (car will get a bit tail happy)

---

330d E90 Owned me in my e36 M3 robot to robot...

Yes i wasnt pushing it however since my engine was fairly cold.

Havin had both I can comfortably say E36 M3 at the Reef will murder the 330d , stock for stock and yep rather let the Diesel win instead of running cold temp oil on a ///M.