Pravin, your expertise please

[Mike1]

Hey Pravin

I have a couple of questions which I would like your perspective and technical knowledge on.

1. According to what I have read, Megs #85 is a pure compound with no fillers and a 10/10 cut. Its a product that I have grown to absolutely love. However, I am concerned as on the bottle is a "mirror glaze" sticker and with a Fexi Pad (Firm) this combo is super abrasive, as I am working it I can actually see the defects disappearing which reminds me a lot of glazes and fillers. Can you confirm that there are no fillers in #85? I am sure it is pure, its just the glaze sticker has me thinking... If it is pure then this is a very under-rated product!

2. I used the EZ Creme Glaze on the E34 M5 (Rick540's) to minimize the harsher defects on the paint, allowed it to haze and then did two layers of Chemical Guys XXX Hardcore Paste Wax. The result was excellent, I am however curious to know if I need to allow time between the glaze and the wax/sealant. Can it just be put on straight away or must I give the paint some time? I have not seen a difference when testing but I am curious.

3. Does Wet Butter Wax contain fillers?

4. How long should you let the CG Extreme Top Coat Sealant cure for? Does layering it make any difference?

In no rush, so take your time - Looking forward to knowing more though.

And finally, a huge thank you to Crazy Detailer for the awesome service and products. You guys are the best detailing store in SA!

Mike

 

[Raybimmer]

" in no rush..." car will turn to pumpkin in 36 minutes time , will products work on pumpkin...:roflol::roflol:


Sorry for hijack..

 

[Mike1]

" in no rush..." car will turn to pumpkin in 36 minutes time , will products work on pumpkin...:roflol::roflol:


Sorry for hijack..

:werd:




































:roflol:

 

[Phumi]

Subscribed

 

[Pravin@crazydetailer]

Hey Pravin

I have a couple of questions which I would like your perspective and technical knowledge on.

1. According to what I have read, Megs #85 is a pure compound with no fillers and a 10/10 cut. Its a product that I have grown to absolutely love. However, I am concerned as on the bottle is a "mirror glaze" sticker and with a Fexi Pad (Firm) this combo is super abrasive, as I am working it I can actually see the defects disappearing which reminds me a lot of glazes and fillers. Can you confirm that there are no fillers in #85? I am sure it is pure, its just the glaze sticker has me thinking... If it is pure then this is a very under-rated product!

2. I used the EZ Creme Glaze on the E34 M5 (Rick540's) to minimize the harsher defects on the paint, allowed it to haze and then did two layers of Chemical Guys XXX Hardcore Paste Wax. The result was excellent, I am however curious to know if I need to allow time between the glaze and the wax/sealant. Can it just be put on straight away or must I give the paint some time? I have not seen a difference when testing but I am curious.

3. Does Wet Butter Wax contain fillers?

4. How long should you let the CG Extreme Top Coat Sealant cure for? Does layering it make any difference?

In no rush, so take your time - Looking forward to knowing more though.

And finally, a huge thank you to Crazy Detailer for the awesome service and products. You guys are the best detailing store in SA!

Mike

Hey Mike

1) Mirror glaze is a range name from meguiars rather than the actual glaze itself. You will find all the pro products named Mirror Glaze. You even get dispenser bottles and spray bottles etc. from the range:

So I wouldn't stress too much about that if I were you. You were correct in the first place, it is a true compound. And an aggressive one at that. You will find that it does cut quite quickly, but it definitely needs to be cleaned up after. It will leave slight haziness. You may not notice this on light colours, but it become clear as day on darker colours. Also, Meguiars recommend only using a rotary polisher with this compound due to its cut.

Due to M85 using DAT (Diminishing Abrasive Technology) the usual method of cleaning up is to follow-up with M83 or M80, which also uses DAT. My issue with this method is both of these are GLAZES and not POLISHES. Which means, it does cut and will clean up to a certain point BUT you will never know whether the glaze has filled or if you have TRUE correction.

As you know the higher the cut, the harsher the finish. You have to follow up with the finer polishes to really get that deep clear gloss. So what I prefer is to have the aggressive compounds ONLY for the tough jobs, and then follow-up with Menz PO203S, and if its darker paint, go one more step and clean-up further with Menz PO106FF.

2.) EZ Cream is great! More so on darker and solid colours like red etc. It does not need to cure, so you work it into the paint like a polish, and immediately remove. There's no "breathing" time required between steps, so once complete with the entire car, you will be good to go with the LSP.

3.) Most LSP's (Last Step Product, refers to either wax or sealant) by its very nature are fillers. It bonds to the paintwork, and therefore will fill to a certain extent. These fillers endurance depends purely on how well the wax lasts. So yes, BWW will fill to a degree.

Fillers are not a bad thing. When working on customers cars, you definately don't want to fill before the LSP. You want TRUE correction cos you know for sure that your finish will last and not just wash off. But on my own cars, I am quite happy to go over the car with a filler glaze to maintain its finish. If you keep correcting, you will be left with NO clearcoat :rollsmile: So fillers definately has its place. :thumbs:

4.) When talking about curing, theres two curing times we speak about. One is when you apply the product to the paint, allow 20 minutes for it to haze (cure) and then buff clean. Then after that, you want to allow the wax to "breath" (again cure), before wetting the surface again. This wetting can be by means of final detail spray or even the second coat of lsp. I like to leave the finish for approx 1 hour, before wetting. (Please note, this is not scientific by any means, its just gut feel.) I picked this up after using WolfGang Deep Gloss. The recommended curing for that sealant is 12 hours ! So using the same rules for that, I apply it to all my LSP's.

It kinda makes sense if you think about it. Allow the product to breath before going onto the coat. And yes, layering any lsp definately makes a difference, both visually and endurance wise. But remember, I'm only talking about pure waxes and sealants i.e products without cleaners.

Mike, I know I may have gone in depth where not necessary as I'm sure you quite aware about most of what I said. I did this for the benifit of people who are not detailers and are just looking for more info and better their technique. I guess thats the great thing about discussing these type of things on an open forum, everyone can benefit :idea:

I hope I covered what you were after?

 

[Mike1]

Thank you Pravin

Surprisingly the only real after effects I get from the #85 are very faint holograms which come out with one pass of Ultimate Compound or Pro Polish on a finishing pad.

I also like to use tiny amounts and spray the panel with a fine mist of water before polishing which lessens the severity of the cut but still offers superb results.

A few more random questions if I may:

1. Rim Wax, love this stuff. I havent noticed that it fills, so can I use a glaze on a mag wheel with light scratches (think MK5/MK6 Golf GTI Rims) to fill and then coat with a layer of rim wax? Or would that not be advised? I havent tried this yet.

2. Besides Wolfgang, what cheap, easy glaze do you recommend from your stock at Crazy Detailer?

3. Besides Extreme Top Coat, what cheap, easy sealant do you recommend from your stock at Crazy Detailer?

4. Which type of Menzerna Polish / pad combo do you recommend to get beautiful finishing? I did a Renault RS in burnt orange a few days ago and nothing I did could make that paintwork gleam. It didnt pop and flake like it should have and I think it was down to poor finishing even though no holograms or swirls were present. What can you suggest?

Alright, thats all for now. :fencelook:

Thank you again for taking the time to assist. :thumbs:

Mike

 

[Pravin@crazydetailer]

Thank you Pravin

Surprisingly the only real after effects I get from the #85 are very faint holograms which come out with one pass of Ultimate Compound or Pro Polish on a finishing pad.

I also like to use tiny amounts and spray the panel with a fine mist of water before polishing which lessens the severity of the cut but still offers superb results.

A few more random questions if I may:

1. Rim Wax, love this stuff. I havent noticed that it fills, so can I use a glaze on a mag wheel with light scratches (think MK5/MK6 Golf GTI Rims) to fill and then coat with a layer of rim wax? Or would that not be advised? I havent tried this yet.

2. Besides Wolfgang, what cheap, easy glaze do you recommend from your stock at Crazy Detailer?

3. Besides Extreme Top Coat, what cheap, easy sealant do you recommend from your stock at Crazy Detailer?

4. Which type of Menzerna Polish / pad combo do you recommend to get beautiful finishing? I did a Renault RS in burnt orange a few days ago and nothing I did could make that paintwork gleam. It didnt pop and flake like it should have and I think it was down to poor finishing even though no holograms or swirls were present. What can you suggest?

Alright, thats all for now. :fencelook:

Thank you again for taking the time to assist. :thumbs:

Mike

Cool no probs, I luuurve talking detailing so fire away :=):

Following up with Ultimate compound or Pro polish is basically what I meant when I said it requires a bit of cleaning up. And yeah, water plays a HUGE roll when compounding or even polishing. I apply a bit of product for the first pass on a damp foam pad. For the second pass, I can sometimes get away with just misting the pad, and buffing. The water seems to bring the product to the surface which allows you to get by with using so much less product. Also, I prefer to mist directly onto the pad and not on the paint. I found that the water ended up spining off and going all over the place :nonono:
Another plus by using just water and not adding more product for the second pass, you end up getting a much finer cut. You will notice it more with M85, as the diminishing abrasives would have broken down somewhat. Reusing those broken down particles will have a slightly lower cut compared to using it neat.

1.) Regarding glazing before rimwax. That won't work. Rimwax contains cleaners, so what ever glaze you lay down, it will be basically removed with the Rimwax. But speaking about Gti polished wheels, I recon you will see a difference using a glaze. I let you in on my little secret on my tailpipes. I use a cleaner glaze on the pipes first, and then followup with Collinite 845. And let me let you, my tail pipes have a mirror effect ! Try it. So for the polished wheels, try cleaning them and then glazing. But instead of Rimwax, use a Sealant instead. This will seal the wheels without removing the glaze. Should look decent I reckon. :idea:

2.) At around R140, EZ creme is probably your best bang for buck glaze around.

3.) Again at R149 ETC sealant is as good as you gonna get. Sure there is Turtlewax Platinum sealant. Don't scoff it of. The Platinum sealant is essentially the same as Autoglym's extra gloss protection. I've tested them side by and promise you will not be able to tell the difference. Endurance and protection is excellent! BUT with that said, I think you definitely get more from ETC as it adds a bit more shine compared to those sealants mentioned above.

4.) Menzerna PO106FF with a white polishing pad from Lake Country would have made that paint GLOW ! Massage a bit of EZ Cream and then top that up with a SEALANT, and you would have had a wickked finish ... Hmmmm this brings back memories of my old Burnt orange RS :inlove: Man I loved that car. I see this as an excuse to post another one of my clean up threads ... :fencelook:

:=):

 

[moranor@axis]

fire?

 

[Rolf]

Interesting read.... luvit raise:

 

[Mike1]

:thumbs:

For me, detailing has been more of a trial by error process from the first car I detailed through to some cars like that Renault RS (the first frenchy I have worked on) and not having a clue.

I somehow get amazing finishes, great results and I dont even understand half of the technicalities of products. Hence my questions because I think I have found an epic set of products and I am absolutely loving the flexi-pads on my Rotary. The firm pad and #85 makes correction a walk in the park!

You wont believe me but I have the perfect products for exhaust tips. I clean them, apply a product called revive (R30 from Builders) which removes staining and makes the chrome go white again, followed by a quick rub with Megs NXT and Rim Wax. Amazing gloss!

I have also found that a lot of products in my range are useful for multiple jobs. I use Maxi Suds for everything, cleaning mags, engine bays etc. I just put a hectic concentrate into a spray bottle and agitate followed by the Black and Decker.

Do you know what sort of durability ETC has on its own with no top up wax? I love the beading it gives as I just popped some onto my bakkie the other day and it was raining the next day.

What is your favourite wax in your range at the store?

So many questions! :joy:

Mike

 

[kabal]

great thread

 

[andrewbuch]

:thumbs: Awesome thread... Keep up the Questions Mike & Pravin keep up with the great answers

 

[Twinz]

Excellent thread :thumbs:

Glad we have two very good detailing/bussiness advertisers onboard :thumbs:

 

[Pravin@crazydetailer]

:thumbs:

For me, detailing has been more of a trial by error process from the first car I detailed through to some cars like that Renault RS (the first frenchy I have worked on) and not having a clue.

I somehow get amazing finishes, great results and I dont even understand half of the technicalities of products. Hence my questions because I think I have found an epic set of products and I am absolutely loving the flexi-pads on my Rotary. The firm pad and #85 makes correction a walk in the park!

Detailing is all about trial and error. What works on one type of paint will not on a different type. Then there is the different colours etc. But when you do it for a while, you get a good feel of what works and what doesn't. So its important to learn from each detail, as everyone of them makes you a better detailer. :idea:

You wont believe me but I have the perfect products for exhaust tips. I clean them, apply a product called revive (R30 from Builders) which removes staining and makes the chrome go white again, followed by a quick rub with Megs NXT and Rim Wax. Amazing gloss!

I'm always open to new techniques and methods, so I'll check it out. For me on my tips I avoid using abrasive polishes as it easily scratches the chrome. For a deep clean and polish I use AutoGlym's Metal polish. The only non abrasive one I've come across, and then follow up with the glaze and Colli.

I have also found that a lot of products in my range are useful for multiple jobs. I use Maxi Suds for everything, cleaning mags, engine bays etc. I just put a hectic concentrate into a spray bottle and agitate followed by the Black and Decker.

To be honest, I think you would be better off going with an APC (All Purpose Cleaner) for the wheels and Engine bay. I'm sure the shampoo would work on mild dirt, but for the real dirt and grim a bit of TOUGH love is needed! Check out our APC range: Cyclo APC works a treat and is as cheap as chips. R114 for a 5L which dilutes 10:1 for normal cleaning like wheels, wheel arches etc. For HECTIC grease and grim in the engine bay, 4:1 will work.

Do you know what sort of durability ETC has on its own with no top up wax? I love the beading it gives as I just popped some onto my bakkie the other day and it was raining the next day.

General endurance on most sealants is around 4-6 months. They don't break down as easily as wax, so you get crazy endurance. They will lose the beading fairly quickly though, this doesn't mean that the protection is gone. Just the beading. But we like the beading, don't we? It just looks so much nicer and the ability to repel water assists in the washing and drying process :joy: We generally top up with wax purely for the looks and additional beading. The wax is normally done before the sealant anyway.

What is your favourite wax in your range at the store?

So many questions! :joy:

Mike

Oooooo now you onto my favourite topic. :inlove: I am a bit of a freak when it comes to waxes. I refer to myself as a wax collector as it makes me sound a bit normal. I've sampled almost every wax we've listed. And I've bought the ones I liked. AutoGlym HD, Adams, the Chemical guys range, the entire Collinite range ...

Each have their strengths and I find myself grabbing which ever tub that fancies my mood. I will however say, the range that impressed me the most is the Collinite. They have everything you could want from high carnuba, to endurance, to minute man liquid wax.

We busy with our next USA order and there will be new goodies hitting our shores soon. With new waxes and sealants to tickle my, err I mean your fancy. :rollsmile:

Cant WAIT ! :joy:

---

I'm glad theres others finding value in our chat :bravo:
Thanks for chipping in guys :thumbs:

EDIT: Removed un needed posts as herr bmw created a new thread

 

[Henry330i]

Thanks guys this is a very informative thread

 

[Mike1]

Pravin :thumbs:

I must agree, Collonite for me is the perfect all round wax and the durability especially with two layers is hectic. I like the way it beads as well.

My only issue with collonite is the fact that it is a bugger to work with. I apply it as thinly as possible and still you end up a sweaty mess trying to remove it.

I now put it on, give it less than half a minute and wipe off. I once forgot I had put some on a mag wheel and not even sunlight, APC and even prepsol cleaner was able to get rid of it.

Would you recommend using just the ETC Sealant on its own, or is it better to top up with a wax?

I also purchased a few new products down here in the Cape:

Smart Wax
Chemical Guys Pro Amino Polish 2n
Chemical Guys 788 finishing polish

Do you have any experience with these products?

Mike

 

[andrewbuch]

Mike Which Collinite are you talking about?

I used the #476 on the E90 & applied it a bit too thick & it was a bit difficult to remove but still possible by hand
and have used the #845 and its easy to apply & remove, I apply to whole car, then I applied dash treatment to interior of car then I went to remove the Colli & it came off so easy

 

[Mike1]

I have both but for some or other reason I like the 476 more.

 

[andrewbuch]

for me the 476 is a bit more difficult to remove but they are both awesome... Was driving the E90 yesterday & got caught in heavy rain, then had a few KM's of no rain & by the time I got home the car was dry

 

[Pravin@crazydetailer]

Pravin :thumbs:

I must agree, Collonite for me is the perfect all round wax and the durability especially with two layers is hectic. I like the way it beads as well.

My only issue with collonite is the fact that it is a bugger to work with. I apply it as thinly as possible and still you end up a sweaty mess trying to remove it.

I now put it on, give it less than half a minute and wipe off. I once forgot I had put some on a mag wheel and not even sunlight, APC and even prepsol cleaner was able to get rid of it.

I can't say that I've experienced removing issues with the Colli. I have perfected the art of thin application though. But in the past and experience with other waxes which were a little more differcult to work with, I found a bit of detail spray on the microfiber did the job. I even put 476 to the test once as that is always regarded as Colli's tougher wax. I applied to the entire car and let it dry. Then buffed with microfiber and it came out with ease. So not sure. #845 without a doubt is the easiest wax I have EVER used, easy on easy off. I think a wax may become differcult to remove once wet, its much harder to "wash" a wax off than to buff it off. Worse case, apply a clean layer of wax of the dried bit, and buff immediately.

Would you recommend using just the ETC Sealant on its own, or is it better to top up with a wax?

This depends on the paint finish. If you like to retain the sparkle in the metallic finish, then its best to rather just go sealant. Maybe two coats instead of one sealant, one wax. But if you layering down the sealant for endurance and then wax for higher gloss, then go for it. Just know that waxes tend to "mute" the flake in the paint. It does give a wetter finish though, but that all comes down to preference.

I also purchased a few new products down here in the Cape:

Smart Wax
Chemical Guys Pro Amino Polish 2n
Chemical Guys 788 finishing polish

Do you have any experience with these products?

Mike

I have played with the old range of pro polishes from CG, and do be honest I was a little underwhelmed. They had brilliant working times, no dust etc. BUT they didn't cut well either. There is a new range of professional polishes in the latest shipment and I have a few samples to test. Will see how they work and advise.
Smartwax is great all rounder wax. For joe public who is looking for a great shine, this will be the bee's knees. It has mild cleaners in it and leaves a wet finish. So for somebody who doesn't know about paint prep etc. a cleaner wax will always generate better results than a pure wax. I tend to shy away from cleaner waxes as I like to layer my waxes, or top them up occasionally. Personal preference really.