New beemers.. :(

[kilotango]

@Budleigh

i cant remember who it was, but someone earlier described these newer cars as toasters...and i think its pretty accurate that these cars are being produced as appliances. yes, cars always were appliances, but back then it was mostly about engineering a better car than the others... so more power, better handling, more secure in a crash etc..

right now, theres this whole "eco" thing going on, so its no longer about engineering a better car, its about engineering a car that can tree hug better than the others. that direction to me is ruining what BMW to me as a brand meant... the epitome of everyday sports cars as i grew up...its such a shame. probably something that exists in the M's still, but the mainstream models definitely are made for the carbon footprint free lovers out there.

as an average joe looking at a new car, that gives me the same "feeling" as the ol' E46 in a non M.. im having a hard time :thumbdo:

 

[TBP88]

Never driven anything past the E90s (and even then just a 325). I've sat in the newer BMW shapes, and the F series interiors are pretty insane in terms of the perception of quality, especially when you compare to the old plastics in the E series cars (particularly the E46).

I suppose it comes down to what the consumer wants. The vast majority of profits are from 320i, 118i type cars. Having a quality feel in a premium brand at (what some people consider) reasonable prices is more important than a good engine note or engaging driving.

Considering the prices of the M cars these days (even an M2 goes for over a bar), I'd be looking at a good condition used 911 over most current BMW M cars, just in terms of cost.

 

[maleven-GP]

:YesNo: :tiptoe: :smashScreen: I once test driven a 523I F10... hahahahaha what an excuse of a car :bin:... it had delayed acceleration with no soul at all! My 2.0 polo vw was more exciting..

 

[ASH]

Yes, they make it seem so affordable to get into a new vehicle, but the trap is being lured into a debt recycling cycle, in which you are only paying off a portion of the loan, with the balance becoming payable at the end of the loan term.

Residual has also been disguised as Guaranteed Future Value as well, where the buyback value is the residual value (balloon payment) on the finance loan. One has to also stick to the conditions which BMW stipulate like 20 000kms mileage a year etc.

I found this article of on GFV.

http://frankmagwegwe.com/2-wrong-ways-to-buy-a-new-car/

Also another knock on effect of this on the Used car market is that you are having vehicles returning to the dealership at much higher trade-in values and retailing for much more when compared to 10 years ago. As for example in the article above a 3 year old 320i with 60 000kms will will be traded-in at R251 000, so the dealer would need to spend a bit for reconditioning (tyres, rims, paint work, windscreen, non-motorplan repairs) to get the vehicle into show room condition, plus add in their mark-up. So, it is quite easy these days to be spending over R280K+ for a 3 year old 320i with 60 000kms, which in essence is a vehicle with only 2 years/ 40 000km, Motorplan left, leaving the customer (if financing the vehicle) to finance over a common term of 5 years. This scenario of financing a high value for a used vehicle with only 2 years plan left, is why people have to shifted to new and the reason why you see so many new 3 series vehicles on the road, as the lure of the lower installment on a GFV deal in comparison to used car deal, probably wins.

The new age BMWs don't do much for me either. The thing is, BMW are selling more cars now than they did in the E39/E46 era. So us fossils will just have to suck it up, I guess.

LOL they are only selling more BMW's now than ever before because of a thing called "Residual".

90% of people buying new bmw's these days buy on residual.


Back in the days of E39/E46 era and previous to that, People could only buy a brand new BMW if they could actually afford it. :smashScreen: It's no wander the world is falling into so much financial crap these days.

 

[Mike-R]

Ironically I feel the older BMW 's (pre E90) were garbage, especially the interior.

As it stands ,sadly I find BMW as a whole, garbage.

LOL, you are on the wrong Forum my friend.

Contrary to the above,

About that hey, i own a 335i E90, and i almost kicked myself in the nutsack when i test drove the F30 335i as i was thinking of trading it for my E90.

Well let me tell you, the guys here that say that the F-Series 335i's have lost that feel/soul.................. You are 100% right. I felt it immediately when i planted my foot in the bottom right. Infact, i tapped off, turned around and parked the car and looked at my E and thought. Nah, they can keep this F... My E is better. In so many ways, you feel the road, you feel every bump in the road, you feel the feedback from the steering. Just that "like factor" in the F is gone.

Yes its faster and stronger than the E-Series and looks good in the M-Sport/Performance Pack, but my goodness.... I LOVE MY E90 335I.....

---

Ironically I feel the older BMW 's (pre E90) were garbage, especially the interior.

As it stands ,sadly I find BMW as a whole, garbage.

LOL, you are on the wrong Forum my friend.

Contrary to the above,

About that hey, i own a 335i E90, and i almost kicked myself in the nutsack when i test drove the F30 335i as i was thinking of trading it for my E90.

Well let me tell you, the guys here that say that the F-Series 335i's have lost that feel/soul.................. You are 100% right. I felt it immediately when i planted my foot in the bottom right. Infact, i tapped off, turned around and parked the car and looked at my E and thought. Nah, they can keep this F... My E is better. In so many ways, you feel the road, you feel every bump in the road, you feel the feedback from the steering. Just that "like factor" in the F is gone.

Yes its faster and stronger than the E-Series and looks good in the M-Sport/Performance Pack, but my goodness.... I LOVE MY E90 335I.....

I mean just look at it......

 

[cOlDFuSiOn]

Ironically I feel the older BMW 's (pre E90) were garbage, especially the interior.

As it stands ,sadly I find BMW as a whole, garbage.

LOL, you are on the wrong Forum my friend.

Contrary to the above,

About that hey, i own a 335i E90, and i almost kicked myself in the nutsack when i test drove the F30 335i as i was thinking of trading it for my E90.

Well let me tell you, the guys here that say that the F-Series 335i's have lost that feel/soul.................. You are 100% right. I felt it immediately when i planted my foot in the bottom right. Infact, i tapped off, turned around and parked the car and looked at my E and thought. Nah, they can keep this F... My E is better. In so many ways, you feel the road, you feel every bump in the road, you feel the feedback from the steering. Just that "like factor" in the F is gone.

Yes its faster and stronger than the E-Series and looks good in the M-Sport/Performance Pack, but my goodness.... I LOVE MY E90 335I.....

I don't agree with that in entirety.. I Drive in Sport+/DS all day everyday and I can tell you I have a lot of feedback/feel from the road? The engine sounds amazing for a stock car and I won't trade it for anything except an ///M :=):

 

[Mike-R]

Ironically I feel the older BMW 's (pre E90) were garbage, especially the interior.

As it stands ,sadly I find BMW as a whole, garbage.

LOL, you are on the wrong Forum my friend.

Contrary to the above,

About that hey, i own a 335i E90, and i almost kicked myself in the nutsack when i test drove the F30 335i as i was thinking of trading it for my E90.

Well let me tell you, the guys here that say that the F-Series 335i's have lost that feel/soul.................. You are 100% right. I felt it immediately when i planted my foot in the bottom right. Infact, i tapped off, turned around and parked the car and looked at my E and thought. Nah, they can keep this F... My E is better. In so many ways, you feel the road, you feel every bump in the road, you feel the feedback from the steering. Just that "like factor" in the F is gone.

Yes its faster and stronger than the E-Series and looks good in the M-Sport/Performance Pack, but my goodness.... I LOVE MY E90 335I.....

I don't agree with that in entirety.. I Drive in Sport+/DS all day everyday and I can tell you I have a lot of feedback/feel from the road? The engine sounds amazing for a stock car and I won't trade it for anything except an ///M :=):

Yes i hear you, but the steering rack is still electronic. isnt it?

 

[cOlDFuSiOn]

Ironically I feel the older BMW 's (pre E90) were garbage, especially the interior.

As it stands ,sadly I find BMW as a whole, garbage.

LOL, you are on the wrong Forum my friend.

Contrary to the above,

About that hey, i own a 335i E90, and i almost kicked myself in the nutsack when i test drove the F30 335i as i was thinking of trading it for my E90.

Well let me tell you, the guys here that say that the F-Series 335i's have lost that feel/soul.................. You are 100% right. I felt it immediately when i planted my foot in the bottom right. Infact, i tapped off, turned around and parked the car and looked at my E and thought. Nah, they can keep this F... My E is better. In so many ways, you feel the road, you feel every bump in the road, you feel the feedback from the steering. Just that "like factor" in the F is gone.

Yes its faster and stronger than the E-Series and looks good in the M-Sport/Performance Pack, but my goodness.... I LOVE MY E90 335I.....

I don't agree with that in entirety.. I Drive in Sport+/DS all day everyday and I can tell you I have a lot of feedback/feel from the road? The engine sounds amazing for a stock car and I won't trade it for anything except an ///M :=):

Yes i hear you, but the steering rack is still electronic. isnt it?

100% correct yes Electronic steering on all the F chassis cars, to be honest as I drive the car in Sport+ mode it stiffens the steering feel up a lot. I can't drive the car in eco/comfort, it does not work.

What does get me and this is a MAJOR fail on ALL these cars is the Electronic diff... That thing does not work, if they put a LSD in these from the factory it would indeed be a better car to drive. :thumbdo:

 

[CaTcH21]

Ironically I feel the older BMW 's (pre E90) were garbage, especially the interior.

As it stands ,sadly I find BMW as a whole, garbage.

LOL, you are on the wrong Forum my friend.

Contrary to the above,

About that hey, i own a 335i E90, and i almost kicked myself in the nutsack when i test drove the F30 335i as i was thinking of trading it for my E90.

Well let me tell you, the guys here that say that the F-Series 335i's have lost that feel/soul.................. You are 100% right. I felt it immediately when i planted my foot in the bottom right. Infact, i tapped off, turned around and parked the car and looked at my E and thought. Nah, they can keep this F... My E is better. In so many ways, you feel the road, you feel every bump in the road, you feel the feedback from the steering. Just that "like factor" in the F is gone.

Yes its faster and stronger than the E-Series and looks good in the M-Sport/Performance Pack, but my goodness.... I LOVE MY E90 335I.....

---

Ironically I feel the older BMW 's (pre E90) were garbage, especially the interior.

As it stands ,sadly I find BMW as a whole, garbage.

LOL, you are on the wrong Forum my friend.

Contrary to the above,

About that hey, i own a 335i E90, and i almost kicked myself in the nutsack when i test drove the F30 335i as i was thinking of trading it for my E90.

Well let me tell you, the guys here that say that the F-Series 335i's have lost that feel/soul.................. You are 100% right. I felt it immediately when i planted my foot in the bottom right. Infact, i tapped off, turned around and parked the car and looked at my E and thought. Nah, they can keep this F... My E is better. In so many ways, you feel the road, you feel every bump in the road, you feel the feedback from the steering. Just that "like factor" in the F is gone.

Yes its faster and stronger than the E-Series and looks good in the M-Sport/Performance Pack, but my goodness.... I LOVE MY E90 335I.....

I mean just look at it......

---

Hey bud,

It's just my opinion. I've never owned any other BMW besides my current F30 330i , and of course my father had an E30 325i back in the 90's which I drove quite often.

I did drive the other models E36,E46 and E90 and just refused to buy those cars.

Anyway ...

 

[Quick///M]

Ironically I feel the older BMW 's (pre E90) were garbage, especially the interior.

As it stands ,sadly I find BMW as a whole, garbage.

LOL, you are on the wrong Forum my friend.

Contrary to the above,

About that hey, i own a 335i E90, and i almost kicked myself in the nutsack when i test drove the F30 335i as i was thinking of trading it for my E90.

Well let me tell you, the guys here that say that the F-Series 335i's have lost that feel/soul.................. You are 100% right. I felt it immediately when i planted my foot in the bottom right. Infact, i tapped off, turned around and parked the car and looked at my E and thought. Nah, they can keep this F... My E is better. In so many ways, you feel the road, you feel every bump in the road, you feel the feedback from the steering. Just that "like factor" in the F is gone.

Yes its faster and stronger than the E-Series and looks good in the M-Sport/Performance Pack, but my goodness.... I LOVE MY E90 335I.....

I don't agree with that in entirety.. I Drive in Sport+/DS all day everyday and I can tell you I have a lot of feedback/feel from the road? The engine sounds amazing for a stock car and I won't trade it for anything except an ///M :=):

Yes i hear you, but the steering rack is still electronic. isnt it?

Yes its electronic but still gives some feel that the wheels are planted on the road, after driving a family members Audi A5 with electric steering you begin to appreciate BMW a little more. As for soul any X35i has it, gone are the days where they build cars that makes you feel one with the road and this is due to many reasons safety is number one the list and refinement the second. Many people complain the quality of bmw has dropped but they still have a premium feel to it. Even after 3 years with my M135i it has no rattles and it trust me this car is super strong in terms of build quality. Both Ford STs I owned had some sort of annoying rattles which bugged the hell out of me not to mention other issues.

As for safety I would rather have my family in a BMW and have peace of mind. There isn't another car manufacturer on the PLANET that has a culture like BMW, even 20 year old BMW's are well sought after if that is not "Soul" to you then I don't know what is.

---

Plenty of soul here :blowheart:

[video=youtube]

 

[TurboLlew]

F-chassis M-cars don't have electric steering like the rest of them. Honestly, the last BMWs I enjoyed prior to the FI era were E36 and E39. I liked the E60 M5 and E92/E90 M3... others not so much.

I will upset some of you with comments I'm sure so I will refrain LOL. What I will say about the new cars is that I absolutely CANNOT STAND the non-removable tablet style screen in these cars. It makes no sense! I hated it in the M6 I had as a courtesy car for a week and I hate it even more in the Audi and Mercedes executions.

I enjoy the F30 I get to drive from time to time. If you own a paid up E90 335i then there is little point buying a 340i for what is becoming an absurd amount of money... in fact the chances are high that if you could afford a 335i before, you can't actually buy a 340 now because the cost has increased so dramatically. Goes for all cars for that matter... Dropping R800K+ on a car IMHO needs to make you feel pretty special. That said, F10 and F30 non-M owners seem to love their cars (in many cases, enough to buy several). The thing I hate with the new B-motors is that they sound like tractors (had an almost brand new F30 as a courtesy car recently as well and it was nice to drive but sounded so rough!). I don't think I'd own a non-M BMW of the current era... enough M cars to choose from in 4 and 2 door forms in the used market (or even new when considering M140 and 240i). I'm possibly going to pick up an M6 cabriolet later this year... not sure I can justify an R35 given that I now have 2 kids and precious little time for track days) ... anyway point is, it probably won't cost more than a kitted out 5 series by that time. Given my experience and confidence with the M5 drivetrain, I will just extend the plan by a few years and enjoy more german/slovenian sounds instead of buying a new car for similar money.

In the South Africa we live in now, it is difficult to justify ANY car. Look at what VWs, Renaults, Hyundais, Kias etc. cost let alone MB/Audi/BMW. G30 with some boxes ticked was 1.3M... Of course people's salaries have not increased by that much and folks are not suddenly all earning R150K a month so GFV/Residual is the only way that new cars are being sold. Mercedes Midrand a while ago when we went to look for a car for my wife ONLY showed GFV deal structures (which they call Agility finance) on their info-sheets... and had sales tactics clearly targeting those who have recently come through our school system LOL. People are buying Golfs today costing what some very special cars cost some of us not that long ago... From a new car perspective, we are the frogs in the proverbial pot. The water is already now boiling and by the time we end 2017 it is going to be even worse...

 

[kilotango]

i went to pick up my new (second hand) renault clio from the renault dealership this weekend...and next door they have a BMW showroom. as i was waiting outside, i saw a really nice F30 driving towards me to exit the gate.

when i saw this car coming, a moment of sadness passed through me. this car just looked awesome and i found myself wishing that my budget could've allowed me to get that car instead. i started to rethink the choices i made in my life, and i almost started having a feeling of regret of not having busted my ass even harder than i did, to afford a car like that. i was having second thoughts about everything i've done, up until that moment and thinking how that could've been me driving that car.

then as it went passed me, and i heard the noise it made... i just looked at the guy from the dealership that was waiting with me, and said "F*ck, thats disappointing hey!!!" and i started laughing.

to see a car like that go passed, and sound almost like the 1.2l clio i just bought was hilarious AF.

i know i might be old fashioned and stupid, but a car like that really deserves to have a proper straight six noise coming out of it mgwaiting: