My Stock ED35 Dyno graph at ALB at the ST dyno day

[Crash_Nemesis]

ZEEMAX is flywheel power not wheel power.

Check the dyno sheet, it says Engine power on the Y axis of the graph
.

Hmmm, it seems you are right, but considering the thread that pic came from, I was lent to believe it was infact wkw, but to humour your argument, here is a dyno of my car in Cape Town. This is Engine Power.

My argument still stands... 18% drivetrain loss of 245kw is 205wkw. Yet my car only does 185wkw here.

So, If I can stay neck and neck with a stock 135i DCT here in Jozi, but beat one in Cape Town, that just proves that these Dyno corrections used in JHB are over inflated.

 

[Cooper]

Have you taken into consideration the high altitude in JHB?

---

I must admit 175wkw on a factory claimed 173kw engine does sound a bit out

 

[Crash_Nemesis]

Cooper... please go read my posts again... I have taken into account the loss of power due to altitude.

My question is why do Turbo charged cars get the same ambient correction as NA cars? Not comparing my car between JHB and Cape Town. I brought my car into the mix because I have run against 135i's who have done 200wkw on the dyno, yet we are the dead even up here at altitude. So my point is surely he isn't 200wkw then... Thus my reasoning for thinking the 30% ambient correction on a turbo car is too high. Am I making sense here or not?

Surely it should not be the same ambient correction.

Lets go back to basics.

A turbo makes air more dense, right?

So, in theory, a turbo car in JHB will not be affected by high Altitude power loss like an NA car will. Therefore, why the high ambient correction on Turbo cars?

 

[Kish2604]

Ash225... Loving the dyno numbers at a dyno day... Testing what the dyno numbers mean on the road as a difference is even better...

Enjoy the car and when the tuning bug bites.. Go for it!

 

[Ash225]

No probs Crash, lets look at it this way....


Peak power means bullshit!!!

A car making 180wkw constantly will out run a car that only peaks at 200wkw for 500rpm....i.e. the 180wkw car makes more power everywhere else and its only at that specific rpm range that the other car will be faster...

The E46 M3 keeps building up power and hence it has a better power curve, a 135 makes it power and then drops off...so basically yes its theoretically easy to see that the M3 can pull it...

Now faster is also NOT about power but power to weight is key as well as aerodynamic efficiency....

a 2000kg car that makes 250kw (power to weight 125kw/ton) will be slower than a car weighing 1000kg's and making only 150kw(150kw/ton).... so more power doesnt mean faster!

I have never said my car is faster than any other car...I dont know, yes, its just a little Golof.....

Now I dont know why they use 30%....as far as I know they all use similar percentages.....it really will be nice to get one of the dyno owners to comment on this....

---

Ash225... Loving the dyno numbers at a dyno day... Testing what the dyno numbers mean on the road as a difference is even better...

Enjoy the car and when the tuning bug bites.. Go for it!

I know dude, I used to chow 200wkw ST's with my 156wkw modded Megane RS......

 

[Sendhur]

Awesome Power Ash, your car put it down well on the dyno, and it ran well for a stock car at the drags on Sunday! dont worry what anyone says as long as the car is performing and putting the power down!

Now please start with the Mods :thumbs:

 

[Ash225]

Cooper... please go read my posts again... I have taken into account the loss of power due to altitude.

Lets do some proper calculations here: 17% power loss for altitude as i researched on the internet and that has been confirmed by the Avaition guys.... and 18% for drive train loss.....hope you agree with those numbers?

Now 252kw less the altitude loss is 252*17% = 209.16kw now to convert to wheel kw we deduct the 18% drive train loss: 209.16*18% = 171.5wkw

 

[Sendhur]

Nice calculation there Ash raise:

:bravo:

 

[BrandonF1]

Guys taking dyno's to seriously here. Whats important to remember is exactly what Ash has said, its not always about peak power. What also needs to be taken into conisderation is that wednesday cars do exist, as Crash has said and from my experience ed35's seem to be wednesday cars from factory:thumbs:

The low torque levels of the ed35 show that is is def stock as when you boost a k04 torque goes easily into the 400's.

As for e46 M3's, there are some monsters out there and some sick one's. I beat one with my Megane a year or so back. But also seen some dish some hidings....

 

[dvst8]

I predict that this is gonna go south from here. :nono:

* EDIT: M3's run with my 1M. And believe me the 1M destroys ED35 and R's.
http://www.bmwfanatics.co.za/showthread.php?tid=42870

Not always.

I used to "destroy" M3's, 2 x 1M's and 135's with my ex K04.

:fencelook:

When looking at any dyno graph, you need to compare with others cars that ran o the same day with the same corrections etc.

You cannot compare to quoted figures and runs from different dyno's and different days.

:thumbs:

 

[SP33DYV]

I predict that this is gonna go south from here. :nono:

* EDIT: M3's run with my 1M. And believe me the 1M destroys ED35 and R's.
http://www.bmwfanatics.co.za/showthread.php?tid=42870

Not always.

I used to "destroy" M3's, 2 x 1M's and 135's with my ex K04.

:fencelook:

When looking at any dyno graph, you need to compare with others cars that ran o the same day with the same corrections etc.

You cannot compare to quoted figures and runs from different dyno's and different days.

:thumbs:

"There is always a Golf that is faster than your car" I know this.

 

[dvst8]

I predict that this is gonna go south from here. :nono:

* EDIT: M3's run with my 1M. And believe me the 1M destroys ED35 and R's.
http://www.bmwfanatics.co.za/showthread.php?tid=42870

Not always.

I used to "destroy" M3's, 2 x 1M's and 135's with my ex K04.

:fencelook:

When looking at any dyno graph, you need to compare with others cars that ran o the same day with the same corrections etc.

You cannot compare to quoted figures and runs from different dyno's and different days.

:thumbs:

"There is always a Golf 1 that is faster than your car" I know this.

fixed

:rollsmile:

 

[SP33DYV]

I predict that this is gonna go south from here. :nono:

* EDIT: M3's run with my 1M. And believe me the 1M destroys ED35 and R's.
http://www.bmwfanatics.co.za/showthread.php?tid=42870

Not always.

I used to "destroy" M3's, 2 x 1M's and 135's with my ex K04.

:fencelook:

When looking at any dyno graph, you need to compare with others cars that ran o the same day with the same corrections etc.

You cannot compare to quoted figures and runs from different dyno's and different days.

:thumbs:

"There is always a Golf 1 that is faster than your car" I know this.

fixed

:rollsmile:

:lmoa:

---

Like this one:
[video=youtube]

Apologies for the thread jack.

 

[Nikhil]

I believe that dyno figures shouldn’t be something you hold on to. The only time you should consider them is when mods are being done and a before and after comparison is wanted, however this needs to be done on the same dyno with the same factors such as correction ect. You could take a stock car lets use a Toyota tazz and dyno it with a 0% correction factor and you will get reading X, increase the correction factor to say 10% and reading X will increase accordingly irrespective if you inland or at the coast. My personal opinion on this is that all correction factors should remain at 0% even if you live inland. You make what you make and thats it. No point in knowing how much power your car will make in Kzn if you live in Gp.Yes manufacturers may under quote power figures but within reason. Chris’s points as well as Ash’s points are valid at the end of the day wkw from a dyno means nothing. It all boils down to what you do on the tarmac and driver skill. Nice discussion tho and looking at the graph the power transition is really seamless and constant for a turbo car!

thanks :=):

 

[gavsadler]

VAG cars are underrated, but that being said, so are the X35i's :rollsmile:

My 2c, from the research I have done over the years, they say 17-18% power loss for N/A cars at the reef, and approx. 5% loss for turbo cars. Then there are the drivetrain losses as mentioned above, more for RWD cars than FWD cars.

My wife has an A3 2.0T. Claimed 147kw at the flywheel, but it pushed out 145wkw at KAR, which translates to approx. 170kw.

I also take Dyno readings with a pinch of salt, but the correction factors are confusing. On my 130i, the correction factors were always 24-28%. Now in 2013 the correction factors are 30% wherever you go. What happened? Inflation??? El Nino???? Dyno Tax for Nkandla funding??? :rollsmile:

I know on overseas forums there have been many posts about dynos and how they cheat to make you believe you are making power etc. Just too many articles to read.

Ultimately at the end of the day, it's your butt-dyno which counts :thumbs: You can have as much fun in a lower powered car as one pushing big numbers. Examples in the production world are the MX-5, Toyota 86, Clio RS and so on.

Sorry, I'll also stop waffling now.

 

[GoCart]

Interesting discussion, I only have one question:

Why have corrections for FI cars at all, they dump the access pressure via a waste gate, so cannot benefit from ambient conditions anyway….

Does this make sense?

 

[petrivanzyl]

Dyno Tax for Nkandla funding???

:biglol::biglol::roflol::roflol::bravo:

 

[sly gxi]

blah blah blah. calculations , assumptions,. ive driven this ed 35 and its kak strong for a stock 35 . it will crank a stock E46 M here in jhb for sure , im sure the M will come back way up top tho.

only way to tell is race one.