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Read the WELCOME ALL BMWFANATICS post.
High km e92 M3 - what's wrong with it???
- Thread starter Alfaholic
- Start date
It is always a difficult decision when buying a car out of motorplan.
I have owned 3 E46 M3's, one of which had no motorplan shortly after I bought it.
Currently I own an E92 M3 that is still under motorplan and a 2005 E60 that went out of motorplan 3 yrs ago.
My experience with the E46's I owned was good. The last E46 I owned is the one referred to above that had very little motorplan when I bought it. The car was used as a dedicated track car and was therefore driven very hard. It gave no problems. The only precautionary measure I took before racing it was to replace the conrod bolts (a flaw on the E46 M3). The 3rd gear syncro also needed replacing after 2 yrs but I used an independent workshop that was much cheaper than the agents. Other than that the M3 was hassle free and very reliable.
My advice is to get the detailed service record. Check the service history and look out for any recurring repairs on the service history.
If you find a clean E92 M3 that has a clean service history that has not been chipped or had software upgrades then I think you will derive a lot of pleasure from it. Just bear in mind that with age comes repair bills. Even with low or reasonable mileage a pampered car will have minor issues. For example radiator leaks, dead batteries that need replacing, leaking radiator hoses etc. I only mention these items because my E60 530 was pristine when I bought it with only 58,000kms but 3 yrs on things start to break and if you use the agents it gets expensive. The E60 is almost 8 yrs old and it is quite normal for things to start breaking at that age. Just bear that in mind if you buy a 5 year old M3 that you are going to have to expect things to break or fail. Hopefully they will not be major mechanical or electrical issues.
Budget for ongoing minor repairs if this is going to be your daily driver. However take solace from the fact that there are reputable workshops that you can use that will be cheaper than the agents.
The E92 M3 is magnificent. The E46 M3 is also a brilliant car.
Hope you manage to buy one after you have done your sums...and some soul searching.
I have owned 3 E46 M3's, one of which had no motorplan shortly after I bought it.
Currently I own an E92 M3 that is still under motorplan and a 2005 E60 that went out of motorplan 3 yrs ago.
My experience with the E46's I owned was good. The last E46 I owned is the one referred to above that had very little motorplan when I bought it. The car was used as a dedicated track car and was therefore driven very hard. It gave no problems. The only precautionary measure I took before racing it was to replace the conrod bolts (a flaw on the E46 M3). The 3rd gear syncro also needed replacing after 2 yrs but I used an independent workshop that was much cheaper than the agents. Other than that the M3 was hassle free and very reliable.
My advice is to get the detailed service record. Check the service history and look out for any recurring repairs on the service history.
If you find a clean E92 M3 that has a clean service history that has not been chipped or had software upgrades then I think you will derive a lot of pleasure from it. Just bear in mind that with age comes repair bills. Even with low or reasonable mileage a pampered car will have minor issues. For example radiator leaks, dead batteries that need replacing, leaking radiator hoses etc. I only mention these items because my E60 530 was pristine when I bought it with only 58,000kms but 3 yrs on things start to break and if you use the agents it gets expensive. The E60 is almost 8 yrs old and it is quite normal for things to start breaking at that age. Just bear that in mind if you buy a 5 year old M3 that you are going to have to expect things to break or fail. Hopefully they will not be major mechanical or electrical issues.
Budget for ongoing minor repairs if this is going to be your daily driver. However take solace from the fact that there are reputable workshops that you can use that will be cheaper than the agents.
The E92 M3 is magnificent. The E46 M3 is also a brilliant car.
Hope you manage to buy one after you have done your sums...and some soul searching.
kabal said:
The original spec conrod bolts were deemed not to be strong enough for racing applications. A friend who raced an E46 M3 had a conrod bolt failure and lost his engine as a result. He did a lot of digging around afterwards and discovered that there were a number of bolt failures. S54s built after 12/13/02 have different connecting rods and bolts than early S54s. They are smaller, one-time use stretch bolts.
When I took delivery of the E46 M3 in 2008 from a BMW dealer I asked them to check if the bolts had been replaced. They claimed that another BMW agent had replaced them but upon inspection we saw that the original spec conrod bolts were still fitted. We had them replaced by the agents but with bolts that I imported from the USA (ARP conrod bolts).
I have another friend who has supercharged his E46 M3 and he decided not to replace them. As far as I know he has not had any issues.
If you plan on having your engine spend a lot of time in high revs (prolonged and high revs over 7,000 rpm), replace the conrod bolts. I replaced them as a precautionary measure given that the car was going to be used as a track car. My conrod bolts never failed.
W
wikk3d88
Guest
Alfaholic said:
Its not like owning a GTI.
Look up what a replacement set of tyres will cost you. and what services out of motorplan will cost you. Its a significant financial decision. Like I said, you cant have champagne motoring on an oros budget.
wikk3d88 said:
Well IF i do buy the car it will be financed.
I will pay no insurance.
I will make use of its power:inlove: which means tyres will have to be bought frequently - does it have to be run flats?
if out of MP I'll service it at a reputable workshop whom you guys must reccomend.
I'll keep my credit card handy for when shit hits the fan.
It will not be my daily...maybe just now and then...ah, who am I kidding, I'll drive it as often as possible.:rollsmile:
So what I'm gathering here is that NO ONE has come out and said "hey man, great decision...its a great car and buy one you'll be happy" what I've heard instead, and what I've asked for, is the blunt, honest truth. The e92 M3 is not a car for a poor person/someone who can barely afford the car...your pockets must be deep, when, I repeat, when something goes wrong, it will cost an arm and a leg if out of MP, even in MP the tyres must be considered as something significant in your budget...don't discount the fuel stations as you'll be known by all petrol attendants as you'll frequent this more than you'll frequent your wife's undergarments...
Suddenly, watching all the YouTube vids and listening to the V8 sound isn't so cool anymore.
I really WANT this car, I'm sick of generic power from small turbo hatches and I'm equally sick of fwd cars... I really want big natural power to the rear wheels...
Maybe I must lower my standards to an e46 M3???
lemme see:
I can afford one for R450k.
It will NOT be my daily.
I already fill up my tuned Alfa GQV once a week - R650-700 per tank.
I buy tyres once a year (I'm not going to lie - IF i'm blessed with an M3 I'll smoke the tyres, there is NO doubt about that)
I WILL modify it - if only an exhaust and wheels and coilies.
I'm suddenly in 2 minds. I come from an Alfa Romeo background, my dad and I have owned many an Alfa and we never, ever had issues with our cars, we travel alot and we never had any issues, before we buy Alfa's we do as much research as possible and then replace the parts that causes k@k - so what I'm hearing is an M3 in MP is doable...an M3 out of MP is looking for k@k...
This makes me think though - why would BMW make a car that is a no-no out of its MP/support structure??? Was the car made for those who own it within MP? Someone has to buy these cars in future when they have maningy km's on...
The OTHER issue I have is the price of the 08 models, nearly R500k for a soon to be 5 year old car, which will be financed and then paid off in 4 years again...by then the car is 9 years old...
Hhhhmmm, I now understand where the soul searching advice comes from.
:ty:
dvst8
///Member
msm@PromotecAuto said:
IMHO there is a difference between an abused car and a tuned/raced car.
To me abused would be spinning, no proper maintainance and just driving the car like an animal. Not all tuned/raced cars are driven that way.
Personally when buying a used car, I would prefer a car that was driven hard than one that was nursed.
:thumbs:
boost3d
Honorary ///Member
Alfaholic said:wikk3d88 said:
Well IF i do buy the car it will be financed.
I will pay no insurance.
I will make use of its power:inlove: which means tyres will have to be bought frequently - does it have to be run flats?
if out of MP I'll service it at a reputable workshop whom you guys must reccomend.
I'll keep my credit card handy for when shit hits the fan.
It will not be my daily...maybe just now and then...ah, who am I kidding, I'll drive it as often as possible.:rollsmile:
So what I'm gathering here is that NO ONE has come out and said "hey man, great decision...its a great car and buy one you'll be happy" what I've heard instead, and what I've asked for, is the blunt, honest truth. The e92 M3 is not a car for a poor person/someone who can barely afford the car...your pockets must be deep, when, I repeat, when something goes wrong, it will cost an arm and a leg if out of MP, even in MP the tyres must be considered as something significant in your budget...don't discount the fuel stations as you'll be known by all petrol attendants as you'll frequent this more than you'll frequent your wife's undergarments...
Suddenly, watching all the YouTube vids and listening to the V8 sound isn't so cool anymore.
I really WANT this car, I'm sick of generic power from small turbo hatches and I'm equally sick of fwd cars... I really want big natural power to the rear wheels...
Maybe I must lower my standards to an e46 M3???
lemme see:
I can afford one for R450k.
It will NOT be my daily.
I already fill up my tuned Alfa GQV once a week - R650-700 per tank.
I buy tyres once a year (I'm not going to lie - IF i'm blessed with an M3 I'll smoke the tyres, there is NO doubt about that)
I WILL modify it - if only an exhaust and wheels and coilies.
I'm suddenly in 2 minds. I come from an Alfa Romeo background, my dad and I have owned many an Alfa and we never, ever had issues with our cars, we travel alot and we never had any issues, before we buy Alfa's we do as much research as possible and then replace the parts that causes k@k - so what I'm hearing is an M3 in MP is doable...an M3 out of MP is looking for k@k...
This makes me think though - why would BMW make a car that is a no-no out of its MP/support structure??? Was the car made for those who own it within MP? Someone has to buy these cars in future when they have maningy km's on...
The OTHER issue I have is the price of the 08 models, nearly R500k for a soon to be 5 year old car, which will be financed and then paid off in 4 years again...by then the car is 9 years old...
Hhhhmmm, I now understand where the soul searching advice comes from.
:ty:
Yes, thats what swayed my decision, its R500k+ for a car thats nearly 5yrs old and almost out of motorplan....
note, that you can extend your motorplan for "TIME" by another 2years, which brings it in total to 7yrs or 100000km whichever comes first, this option is usually alot cheaper then extending your motorplan from 100k to 120k.Bmw use some fancy formula which takes into account how much mileage under motorplan you are purchasing, eg if your car is on 98k, and you want to extend to 120k, then the formula would be 120000-98000 multiplied by the rand value per kilometre that they charge.
Jerez
Well-known member
Alfaholic said:
The only guarantees in life are Tax and Death.So,Re the little niggles on an e92. I bought a 5 year old in March with 42k on the clock.Its had 3 previous owners and the last 2 had it for 6 months each.I suppose they couldnt handle the fuel and insurance bills.Touch wood,mines a beautiful example in Jerez Black.Ive had to fill a ltr of oilafter soem 3k kms and that was it.I have the balance of BMWs warranty until March next year and that when I will renew the warranty for another.
I drive mine on weekends only and yesterday was the first time I drove it after 17 days.We've been having minus 5 degree weather here.So I dont know about this battery problem "douglas" speaks of.The only 2 bits of advice I can give you is that you should buy from a main dealer and that modding is a mugs game.
The e92 is one of the fastest production cars on the streets today.Theres nothing to prove and no one to prove it to.Just its presence says dont mess with me or better still "mess with me,I dare you" - Are you going to chip it to bypass the 8300 rpm limit so that you can take it on an air strip to do your top end.Will you be doing your quarter mile record from traffic light to traffic light.
So,behave and buy a used one from a main dealer,,,, however and this is a BIG however,,,,I cant help you with that silly grin you will have very day when you open that garage door ,peer out your window,look at it whilst passing a shop front...JFDI
S
SP33DYV
Guest
Legacy said:
All I can say is do your homework! You cannot believe what is available out there. 9 out of 10 have had their M/P suspended at some point due to over-revving(non-BMW software) or an accident. I even found one that was claimed to be a 2009, but actually was a 2008 model used by BMW as a test/track/media car, but M/P was only activated in 2009.
Found lots that had their big-end bearings replaced under M/P as well as clutches. Even found one that had several (more than 10) previous owners. I cannot stress enough, do your homework. Get the M/P report and send Coisman the VIN and reg to check the history. I would suggest you get one that has at least some M/P left and that will also have the option to extend it if you need to.
I agree with doing your homework first. I will say that you should go for it afterwards!
As far as mechanics in the Jhb area are concerned I can recommend Evolution 2 Motorsport in Kyalami or Tunetech in Jhb.
Good luck with your decision.
If you test drive it you will buy it...
As far as mechanics in the Jhb area are concerned I can recommend Evolution 2 Motorsport in Kyalami or Tunetech in Jhb.
Good luck with your decision.
If you test drive it you will buy it...
ASH M
Active member
The bearing problems are only up to 2008 models, and most of them where picked up in the States. The bearing didn't totally fail. They where picked up on a few engines that were opened up for modifications to the internals. This was brought to BMW's attention, hence a part number change(new part), from 2009 onwards. It was found that the crank was scored to a certain extent but nothing serious, therefore a campaign was never established. Most of the cars that were affected did some serious track driving and their owners usually stroked their engines after some time, therefore the fault was found.
For a supercharger upgrade the manufacture RECOMMENDS the bearings to be replaced, so I don't think its really an issue else they would have made it compulsorily to change the bearings.
Battery issues are caused by BMW's latest software on the car, anti-tuning puts more load on the battery some how and my battery when after they loaded it on. Thankfully I got rid of it :joy:
The e9x M3 is pretty bullet proof, but has a host of expensive electronic devices that can go boom after a while. So choose wisely, remember that like many sports car out there, its likely to be driven hard most of he time.
For a supercharger upgrade the manufacture RECOMMENDS the bearings to be replaced, so I don't think its really an issue else they would have made it compulsorily to change the bearings.
Battery issues are caused by BMW's latest software on the car, anti-tuning puts more load on the battery some how and my battery when after they loaded it on. Thankfully I got rid of it :joy:
The e9x M3 is pretty bullet proof, but has a host of expensive electronic devices that can go boom after a while. So choose wisely, remember that like many sports car out there, its likely to be driven hard most of he time.
Jerez
Well-known member
Alfaholic said:wikk3d88 said:
Well IF i do buy the car it will be financed.
I will pay no insurance.
I will make use of its power:inlove: which means tyres will have to be bought frequently - does it have to be run flats?
if out of MP I'll service it at a reputable workshop whom you guys must reccomend.
I'll keep my credit card handy for when shit hits the fan.
It will not be my daily...maybe just now and then...ah, who am I kidding, I'll drive it as often as possible.:rollsmile:
So what I'm gathering here is that NO ONE has come out and said "hey man, great decision...its a great car and buy one you'll be happy" what I've heard instead, and what I've asked for, is the blunt, honest truth. The e92 M3 is not a car for a poor person/someone who can barely afford the car...your pockets must be deep, when, I repeat, when something goes wrong, it will cost an arm and a leg if out of MP, even in MP the tyres must be considered as something significant in your budget...don't discount the fuel stations as you'll be known by all petrol attendants as you'll frequent this more than you'll frequent your wife's undergarments...
Suddenly, watching all the YouTube vids and listening to the V8 sound isn't so cool anymore.
I really WANT this car, I'm sick of generic power from small turbo hatches and I'm equally sick of fwd cars... I really want big natural power to the rear wheels...
Maybe I must lower my standards to an e46 M3???
lemme see:
I can afford one for R450k.
It will NOT be my daily.
I already fill up my tuned Alfa GQV once a week - R650-700 per tank.
I buy tyres once a year (I'm not going to lie - IF i'm blessed with an M3 I'll smoke the tyres, there is NO doubt about that)
I WILL modify it - if only an exhaust and wheels and coilies.
I'm suddenly in 2 minds. I come from an Alfa Romeo background, my dad and I have owned many an Alfa and we never, ever had issues with our cars, we travel alot and we never had any issues, before we buy Alfa's we do as much research as possible and then replace the parts that causes k@k - so what I'm hearing is an M3 in MP is doable...an M3 out of MP is looking for k@k...
This makes me think though - why would BMW make a car that is a no-no out of its MP/support structure??? Was the car made for those who own it within MP? Someone has to buy these cars in future when they have maningy km's on...
The OTHER issue I have is the price of the 08 models, nearly R500k for a soon to be 5 year old car, which will be financed and then paid off in 4 years again...by then the car is 9 years old...
Hhhhmmm, I now understand where the soul searching advice comes from.
:ty:
Allow me t clear things up a bit.
Youve owned Alfas ,so you wont be surprised if there are any electrical issues - Not that there are any.
Ive owned Golfs (se) Jettas(cli) Alfa 155 and 147s other models of BMWs.Ive driven a few good cars too and if we discount the Ariel ,this is the most exciting car Ive ever driven (within finacial reach).
You need to be aware of tyres fuel and oil changes and those are the only short term issues I can think of.
Its all about how you treat your car.... you treat it badly and you will soon get to know about it and thats with most things in life.
Dont for one moment think that youd get this v8,starve it of its services and oil changes,neglect tyre changes,drive over speed humps thinking youre in a hovercraft and drive it like a maniac everyday on the streets and it will remain as sweet as a nut then go and buy a 1400 bakkie
A
Chavoos
Active member
I personally would buy a later model E92 335i with no comments and full motorplan. It doesnt have the pedigree of the M3 but in normal day to day driving is easier to live with, less costly, better fuel consumption, longer motorplan, awesome turbo power and more importantly very easy to Mod to make it much faster than M3. The disadvantage is that it isnt the ideal track car.
Or you could opt for an M135i , you could get one thats almost new and is faster than an E92 M3 around nurburgring in stock form.
5 years motorplan , but the styling isnt to everyone's liking and is not a true M car.
By the way , I drive an E36 M3 , ex race car, 229000km on the clock.
This old rapid skodonk doesnt give problems. I only replaced a clutch and brake discs which may bear testament to the strength of the M3 engines.
All the best . You are fortunate to have this dilemma :rollsmile:
Some options :
http://www.autotrader.co.za/used-ca...0/caryearrangeszar/2011/caryearrangeszar/2012
http://www.autotrader.co.za/used-ca...0/caryearrangeszar/2011/caryearrangeszar/2012
From automobilesrevie.com
" A boosted E92 335i is definitely a better choice for everyday use and especially when it comes to a price and running costs. However, one thing is for sure, when you step inside E92 M3, you’ll feel much better. Heart or brain? It’s up to you! "
Or you could opt for an M135i , you could get one thats almost new and is faster than an E92 M3 around nurburgring in stock form.
5 years motorplan , but the styling isnt to everyone's liking and is not a true M car.
By the way , I drive an E36 M3 , ex race car, 229000km on the clock.
This old rapid skodonk doesnt give problems. I only replaced a clutch and brake discs which may bear testament to the strength of the M3 engines.
All the best . You are fortunate to have this dilemma :rollsmile:
Some options :
http://www.autotrader.co.za/used-ca...0/caryearrangeszar/2011/caryearrangeszar/2012
http://www.autotrader.co.za/used-ca...0/caryearrangeszar/2011/caryearrangeszar/2012
From automobilesrevie.com
" A boosted E92 335i is definitely a better choice for everyday use and especially when it comes to a price and running costs. However, one thing is for sure, when you step inside E92 M3, you’ll feel much better. Heart or brain? It’s up to you! "
Thanks for the replies guys, its definitely something to think of.
I found an 08 manual E92 M3 at a dealer close to me, 80000km on the clock...apparently no comments on the MP and they no nothing of a bearing issue in 08 models. The car is a bit scruffy in terms of how the previous owner treated it, interior door handles are scratched etc...im going to take it for a drive tomorrow. I am however looking for the DCT version when i decide. I see there is nice space in the rear so my babas can have ample room.
Im taking my wife with for the test drive...so she can see what I'm going on about and maybe add some sense in he whole matter.
Im all the more squeezing the idea of an e46 M3 in the works as its got a brilliant engine and with CSL intake and Supersprint exhaust can sound equally menacing as the M3...I've got a Supersprint system on my GQV btw and it sounds unique.
What worries me about this M3 I'm driving tomorrow, not that I'm going to buy it(too much km's and condition for R460k isn't good) is that the previous owner had an exhaust installed and he was a mate of the owner of the local BMW dealer and this guy approved this exhaust, however the exhaust isn't a BMW approved unit, the sales guy cant tell me what kind of exhaust it is? I had a look underneath the car and its 2 separate boxes at the rear with NO middle box..it sounds wicked though, while i was under the car i noticed how oily the diff was, with sand/oil mixed all over it as well as on the rear cv's...is this just because the car is a bit old and drove a lot or is this something to be concerned about when i take a look at other M3's in future?
The 335i has been lingering in my mind whenever i think of the M3 but i don't like the 335i's, yes it can be quicker than the M3 but I'm looking for brute N/A hp and not some turbo fed stuff. I know the future has turbo written all over it but id like a N/A motor for a change.
Ill give feedback tomorrow after i drove the V8
I found an 08 manual E92 M3 at a dealer close to me, 80000km on the clock...apparently no comments on the MP and they no nothing of a bearing issue in 08 models. The car is a bit scruffy in terms of how the previous owner treated it, interior door handles are scratched etc...im going to take it for a drive tomorrow. I am however looking for the DCT version when i decide. I see there is nice space in the rear so my babas can have ample room.
Im taking my wife with for the test drive...so she can see what I'm going on about and maybe add some sense in he whole matter.
Im all the more squeezing the idea of an e46 M3 in the works as its got a brilliant engine and with CSL intake and Supersprint exhaust can sound equally menacing as the M3...I've got a Supersprint system on my GQV btw and it sounds unique.
What worries me about this M3 I'm driving tomorrow, not that I'm going to buy it(too much km's and condition for R460k isn't good) is that the previous owner had an exhaust installed and he was a mate of the owner of the local BMW dealer and this guy approved this exhaust, however the exhaust isn't a BMW approved unit, the sales guy cant tell me what kind of exhaust it is? I had a look underneath the car and its 2 separate boxes at the rear with NO middle box..it sounds wicked though, while i was under the car i noticed how oily the diff was, with sand/oil mixed all over it as well as on the rear cv's...is this just because the car is a bit old and drove a lot or is this something to be concerned about when i take a look at other M3's in future?
The 335i has been lingering in my mind whenever i think of the M3 but i don't like the 335i's, yes it can be quicker than the M3 but I'm looking for brute N/A hp and not some turbo fed stuff. I know the future has turbo written all over it but id like a N/A motor for a change.
Ill give feedback tomorrow after i drove the V8
Chavoos
Active member
Correction published:
Last week we reported that the BMW M135i lapped the famous Nordschleife track in just 8:05 minutes, but new details suggest that the time was in fact set on a Bridge to Gantry lap which is shorter and measures only 11.9 miles.
Now, the guys over German magazine Sport Auto lapped the car at the actual Nurburgring Nordschleife track (12.93 miles) and obtained a time of 8:18, making the new M135i just three seconds slower than the the 1-Series M Coupe. The car lapped at the Green Hell was a standard M135i featuring a rear-wheel drive configuration and using a six-speed manual gearbox. All we can do now is wait for an official lap time from BMW.
As a reminder, the M135i is powered by a 3.0-liter in-line six-cylinder engine that delivers a total of 320 HP at 5,800 rpm and 331 lbs-ft of torque. The model will sprint from 0 to 60 mph in 5.1 seconds and can hit a top speed of 155 mph.
Last week we reported that the BMW M135i lapped the famous Nordschleife track in just 8:05 minutes, but new details suggest that the time was in fact set on a Bridge to Gantry lap which is shorter and measures only 11.9 miles.
Now, the guys over German magazine Sport Auto lapped the car at the actual Nurburgring Nordschleife track (12.93 miles) and obtained a time of 8:18, making the new M135i just three seconds slower than the the 1-Series M Coupe. The car lapped at the Green Hell was a standard M135i featuring a rear-wheel drive configuration and using a six-speed manual gearbox. All we can do now is wait for an official lap time from BMW.
As a reminder, the M135i is powered by a 3.0-liter in-line six-cylinder engine that delivers a total of 320 HP at 5,800 rpm and 331 lbs-ft of torque. The model will sprint from 0 to 60 mph in 5.1 seconds and can hit a top speed of 155 mph.
