Front-wheel drive BMW is imminent

[moranor@axis]

because of marketing i very much doubt you will pay much less for a Fwd bmw than you do for a Rwd so then what becomes the point of making it Fwd and taking away the feel?

even if someone does not know what Rwd is they will still feel it is different even though they dont know why...

Fwd will penetrate what market?

 

[Philip Foglar]

FWD is cheaper to make, so my feeling is that if BMW go down that road they are going to simply make more profit, but diminish the brand value in the process! BMW's are driver's cars!! For instance, the X-drive AWD variants are intended for regions with very poor weather conditions rather than trying to compete against Audi and their Quattro's. I go back to that 5'th Gear vid where they compared the three types with a FWD Alfa, AWD Audi, and RWD BMW - guess in which order handled best?! And not just in the case of being entertaining or driver orientated, but safe for that matter!

 

[moranor@axis]

FWD is cheaper to make, so my feeling is that if BMW go down that road they are going to simply make more profit, but diminish the brand value in the process! BMW's are driver's cars!! For instance, the X-drive AWD variants are intended for regions with very poor weather conditions rather than trying to compete against Audi and their Quattro's. I go back to that 5'th Gear vid where they compared the three types with a FWD Alfa, AWD Audi, and RWD BMW - guess in which order handled best?! And not just in the case of being entertaining or driver orientated, but safe for that matter!

+1 no good reason to go Fwd only greed... on the up side the Toyota GT 86 might be the 1 series we wanted :fencelook:

 

[Mike1]

The article already explains which market, a market that uses a car as an A to B. That doesnt care about passion and build quality or ///M Uber alles.

The whole drive for this FWD car is an MPV for mum to hoard the 4 kids and their 3 dogs around in. Its a KIA with a BMW badge on the front.

I would be more upset about the fact that they are making an MPV considering we already have the entire X range and GT range to pick from not to mention the Countryman.

Look what happened the last time Merc tried this!

A market obviously exists for a "premium" we talking anything better than what KIA and Hyundai have already perfected family wagon which is affordable, easy for mum to drive and has a Motorplan.

BMW does not need RWD to make that a success - And this is my point. None of those mums are going to walk into BMW saying I want the fastest RWD Multi Purpose vehicle you have on offer!

None of anything said in this thread attracts any client looking for a MPV to the BMW brand, so why cater for it?

Whilst I would prefer to see BMW continue to produce RWD cars for the rest of my life the fact remains that they have a concept where RWD vs FWD is completely irrelevant and FWD, using a platform like the MINI platform which has proven itself many times already, will cost very little to adapt and then the you pleasing the bean counters too.

The day BMW want to produce the 3 series in FWD is the day you need to start worrying, this is nothing but BMW trying to maximise profits.

Mike

 

[v1p3r]

Rwd is in the DNA of BMW and should never be removed because the car will never feel the same...

there are plenty Fwd cars out there to choose from why make more...

RWD BMWs aren't going anywhere...the entry level 1GT (city car) will become FWD, the 1 Series Coupe (2 series) and 1er Sporthatch will even be RWD. The M cars and larger series models will never change to FWD, but within it's class it makes sense to have FWD because it will be build on the modular Mini platform. It allows for the removal of the transmission tunnel to give occupants more room in the compact car, saved BMW money, and allows more money to be spent on weight saving, efficiency research, ///M and materials development, which is what all of us want anyway.

It's questionable whether the A4 has a better interior than the F30...i was in my cousin's A4 last week and although really nice, I think the F30 has taken a huge step above the E90 and trumps the Audi.

There are plenty of FWD out there...yes, which someone else will buy of BMW doesn't offer a competitor in the same mould. BMW is smart doing this, if they can build a better GTi type car than VW why not? The E87 1xx hatch wasn't outselling the Golf 5/6 and Focus ST anyway...A buyer stolen from any other brand makes BMW stronger

 

[moranor@axis]

mike i am also deeply disturbed that they want to make an MPV everyone knows that it is the poor downtrodden mans SUV putting a bmw badge on the front hardly makes it any better...

maybe just maybe if bmw make an MPV that can go sideways on the weekend with all the kids and the dogs it will bring something exciting and different to the market...

 

[Mike1]

mike i am also deeply disturbed that they want to make an MPV everyone knows that it is the poor downtrodden mans SUV putting a bmw badge on the front hardly makes it any better...

maybe just maybe if bmw make an MPV that can go sideways on the weekend with all the kids and the dogs it will bring something exciting and different to the market...

BMW already offer an uninspiring lineup of Touring Models which nobody wants, they have the X1 which is as dull and cheap as a Micky D's toy and then you have the Countryman which is freaking superb but unfortunately whilst being a superb vehicle just doesnt have that BMW touch which people in that segment are looking for.

Its a top seller but the amount of Countryman customers I lost to X1 & X3 sales tell a different story, but then it would... Two difference brands with different identities.

And the biggest problem is this, Kia will offer you a fully loaded family wagon with more than enough power, gadgets and more for almost half the price of the equivalent X3 or even X1.

They have to compete and this is how its going to happen. :flyfun:

 

[v1p3r]

BMW already offer an uninspiring lineup of Touring Models which nobody wants, they have the X1 which is as dull and cheap as a Micky D's toy

Both are selling pretty well in Europe, and even the States now, so they are achieving their goals...I see a lot of X3's sold here too. I don't want an X1, but if they sell thousands a year and makes BMW money to make the 120d M-Sport and the 3-Series and M cars good, that's good enough for me, because that is what I'm aiming for anyway

 

[moranor@axis]

why do they have to compete? one day when the kids are older and a few have left the house... dad will still want to get something exciting do you really think he will have fond memories of the Kia and stick to the Kia brand?

by making horrible cars like the X1 bmw is not growing the brand but destroying what makes BMW great...

tell you what in 20 years time if the BMW MPV is not an abortion i will buy one and drive it into the nearest tree outside the dealer :rollsmile:

 

[Peter@AEW]

I am somewhat taken aback by the emotion on BMW making a FWD car.

BMW in the recent past along with most manufacturers are competing for market % in what has proven to be challenging times.

They are also cutting down on the quality of materials they use in the cars all in the search for a bigger margin to sustain development and research which is a hugely expensive exercise for a motor manufacturer let alone a privately owned one.

The advent of a FWD BMW needs to be viewed in the context of the market they will be targeting which clearly is not the enthusiast segment.

They need to develop a car which is closer aligned to market realities such as an attractive price reliability styling comfort ease of driving as opposed to enthusiasts desires.

I for one will welcome a FWD BMW as it will afford the company a larger market slice more profits more research and better performance cars for the enthusiast.

 

[hoosain]

no mike completely disagree Rwd is what gives bmw its character...

without it you may as well buy an audi they have better interiors and alot of other things going for them...

next you will argue Subaru should adopt Fwd also :nonono:

Rwd is in the DNA of BMW and should never be removed because the car will never feel the same...

there are plenty Fwd cars out there to choose from why make more...

couldnt have said it better
f@ck:yuck:

 

[v1p3r]

why do they have to compete?



by making horrible cars like the X1 bmw is not growing the brand but destroying what makes BMW great...

To keep market share and outsell their closet rivals who offer, or intend to offer, similar cars. If BMW doesn't offer it, the sale goes to another brand because that is what the buyer is looking for

What makes BMW great is the 3, 5, 7, X and Z series, all widely regarded as benchmarks in their respective classes. Not to mention the ///M models. Building other models does not makes those less great.

If BMW needs to build them, to continue at the forefront, why not? Would you rather see them cede market share and sales to Audi and Benz?

Also, if BMW continues to build best in class, it will only improve their image. Mercedes-Benz adapts (1er vs A-class), Audi adapts (Q vs X) etc... it's an everchanging game, and BMW can't afford to be left behind.

I'd rather see a hot soccer momma in a Bimmer then in a Benz :smileysex::boink:

 

[Clownshoe]

Oh, and for all those crying "thats what MINI is for" I suggest you go have a chat to DP at your closest MINI/BMW dealer cos I can assure you right now that MINI is outselling BMW in a nasty way, I dare you guys to do it.

Dare accepted:

May 2012 RSA BMW sales figures:
BMW models. 2175
MINI models. 236

 

[moranor@axis]

hot soccer mom can keep her comfy, safe merc it suits her better

did i miss something? is BMW in trouble? if anything the other brands are making headway because they are becoming more like BMW by making more exciting cars that make you want to drive them...

how much extra does it really cost to make a prop shaft? surely some of the cost is offset because the front suspension is easier to make? its not like Fwd cars can use less material than Rwd cars anymore because of safety...

 

[petrivanzyl]

Oh, and for all those crying "thats what MINI is for" I suggest you go have a chat to DP at your closest MINI/BMW dealer cos I can assure you right now that MINI is outselling BMW in a nasty way, I dare you guys to do it.

No its not.

 

[Clownshoe]

hot soccer mom can keep her comfy, safe merc it suits her better

did i miss something? is BMW in trouble? if anything the other brands are making headway because they are becoming more like BMW by making more exciting cars that make you want to drive them...

how much extra does it really cost to make a prop shaft? surely some of the cost is offset because the front suspension is easier to make? its not like Fwd cars can use less material than Rwd cars anymore because of safety...

The main advantage of FWD is interior space is drastically increased. Gearbox and drive shaft tunnels can be removed the whole floorpan can drop significantly. The amount of re-inforcing around the rear subframe can drop as it is not handling the torque. The boot space gets much bigger as there is no diff to accommodate. So the car becomes devoid of mechanical stuff behind the bulkhead and you have a lot more design freedom. For a town car having a rear wheel drive is a waste.

You can also mount the engine transversely that shortens the overall length of the car making it easier to park.

Personally I hope that BMW captures a large portion of the market with this car and uses the money to fund a BMW supercar... I can then proceed to not be able to afford it.

 

[moranor@axis]

hot soccer mom can keep her comfy, safe merc it suits her better

did i miss something? is BMW in trouble? if anything the other brands are making headway because they are becoming more like BMW by making more exciting cars that make you want to drive them...

how much extra does it really cost to make a prop shaft? surely some of the cost is offset because the front suspension is easier to make? its not like Fwd cars can use less material than Rwd cars anymore because of safety...

The main advantage of FWD is interior space is drastically increased. Gearbox and drive shaft tunnels can be removed the whole floorpan can drop significantly. The amount of re-inforcing around the rear subframe can drop as it is not handling the torque. The boot space gets much bigger as there is no diff to accommodate. So the car becomes devoid of mechanical stuff behind the bulkhead and you have a lot more design freedom. For a town car having a rear wheel drive is a waste.

You can also mount the engine transversely that shortens the overall length of the car making it easier to park.

Personally I hope that BMW captures a large portion of the market with this car and uses the money to fund a BMW supercar... I can then proceed to not be able to afford it.

thats exactly the point boot space and saving money... BMW?

right now even if you cant afford an M car you can still buy a bit of M magic on a much lower budget...

following the trend of boot space and money in the future almost no one will experience what BMW is about besides those lucky enough to be able to afford an M model...

 

[Taro325]

Don't really like the idea. But BM's are known to be awesome, no matter what they make. :thumbs:
So it will probably end up being the best FWD car around :idea:

 

[kabal]

yah, I dont give a crap

the 3 series will never be FWD, neither, the 5, the 6, the 7, or any ///M cars

 

[Cole]

I think they would be better off making a new range like a "2 series" and make it RWD then change the 1 series to FWD.
Economically it makes sense to do it, I personally know of at least 5 people with a 1 series who had no idea it was RWD so it is a waste, like the article said, they were more interested in the BMW badge and styling than having a RWD car.

I think RWD is what makes BMW special, and it will be sad to dilute the brand in this way, but as long as they do not go like Alfa and move from making beautiful RWD machines to focussing only on FWD then at least the majority of the Beemers will still be RWD.