Desired M Cars

Thami4u

Active member
Old ///M cars, my list is:
M5/6 V10
1M
e70 X5 M
f12 M6
The V8 M3 is one car that has surprised me the most. There's really nothing I can complain about except that being an old car there's always something to attend to.
The e46 M3 is great in isolation but once you start doing an object comparison to the V8 it doesn't match up. The only thing going for it is the timeless design.
 

Gordvisr

Well-known member
Not so old but for me, i will really not mind getting into a F!0 M5. The S63 powerplant is just something else. Been looking at these for a while.
 

VinceM

Well-known member
Not so old but for me, i will really not mind getting into a F!0 M5. The S63 powerplant is just something else. Been looking at these for a while.

I have never driven one, just reading the various reviews, they say its a boat (unless you go aftermarket upgrades).

I really like the F10 shape.


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Gordvisr

Well-known member
cant really believe it is true, driving like a boat, have not driven the F10 yet, but do own a X5///M, and it is not driving like a boat of which it is about half a ton heavier than the F10.
 

Tinuva

Staff & Webmaster
Staff member
Is there a way to add a poll on here?


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I think you will have to post a new thread. It was disabled until now, but I have enabled polls for
Oh I see a moderator can change the thread type to a poll, but will require all teh questions/options. Or even just create a poll on the thread.
 

VinceM

Well-known member
Besides the odd stupidly priced cars, problem we have is inflation, car speculators and new car prices.

new cars are +R2m plus…..

Getting an older M at R500k or less and fixing it for circa R150k …that is still less than third of new car cost. Obviously the new cars have better tech, etc, in most cases, M car buyers needs are mainly driver focused.

(Digressing: car speculators influence the market the wrong way. you find people that also buy cars to sell for big profit, which skews the market. A guy bought an e39 530d, started with R229k selling price with the common “non negotiable” wording in the add, I think now the price is hovering around R154k, soon to drop further. He bought that car a month ago for way less).

Ignoring the price which is low by all measures, percentage to normal selling price is absurd. This example, with an M car worth R1m, 108% profit off the sale price, 72% of retail value, the maths don’t make sense).

Back to topic: these seems to be coming through as favorites:

E63 / E60 V10 NA
E46 M S6 NA
E86 M S6 NA
E92 M V8 NA
1M S6 (Turbo)


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ajm

Active member
Not so old but for me, i will really not mind getting into a F!0 M5. The S63 powerplant is just something else. Been looking at these for a while.
I'm biased, but this, for me, is the business. Beautiful lines, comfortable, transforms from a cruiser to a bruiser with the push of a button, and when fitted with nothing more than dps and a mild tune, will easily keep up with (and, in many cases, embarrass) supercars
 

TurboLlew

Honorary ///Member
I have never driven one, just reading the various reviews, they say its a boat (unless you go aftermarket upgrades).

I really like the F10 shape.


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Just go and drive one (and an F90 while you're at it). You can't trust reviews these days anyway.
 

jayaynikkal

Member
Besides the odd stupidly priced cars, problem we have is inflation, car speculators and new car prices.

new cars are +R2m plus…..

Getting an older M at R500k or less and fixing it for circa R150k …that is still less than third of new car cost. Obviously the new cars have better tech, etc, in most cases, M car buyers needs are mainly driver focused.

(Digressing: car speculators influence the market the wrong way. you find people that also buy cars to sell for big profit, which skews the market. A guy bought an e39 530d, started with R229k selling price with the common “non negotiable” wording in the add, I think now the price is hovering around R154k, soon to drop further. He bought that car a month ago for way less).

Ignoring the price which is low by all measures, percentage to normal selling price is absurd. This example, with an M car worth R1m, 108% profit off the sale price, 72% of retail value, the maths don’t make sense).

Back to topic: these seems to be coming through as favorites:

E63 / E60 V10 NA
E46 M S6 NA
E86 M S6 NA
E92 M V8 NA
1M S6 (Turbo)


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Get an E46 M3 (manual) and call it a day, meneer

Arguably the most reliable and timeless M out there
 

swazi85

Active member
On my list I’m actively looking to buy is either

E30 325is (semi given up due them being over hyped)
E28 m5 (currently looking for one)
E92 m3 manual (currently looking for one that makes sense)


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Red Line

Member
Interesting topic VinceM!

I think it depends on where and when your love for the ///M badge started. That could depend on your childhood, what era you were born in, what cars were in your neighborhood (friends and family) and even what car your parents owned (if they did have a car). Everyone will have a story of the first time they went in xyz M or guy down the road had one when it first came out etc etc…

For me, it is definitely the E36 M3! When I was in high school and started learning about cars this stood out for me. I probably noticed one for the 1st time in 97/98 (even though they were out for a few years already) and that “dolphin shape” with those motorsport rims was just a winner. At that time it wasnt even about this spec that spec 2 door 4 door…M was M!

It ignited my love for the brand and the M dream. I think every M is special and will always have a story to someone and for that reason will be desired and the nostalgia drug story lol is a real thing! Took me a while to start loving the E46 naturally and never appreciated the E92 when it came out due to me personally chasing 1/4 mile etc but much respect what an awesome car it is!! Don’t know why but always preferred the M3 over the M5s. The only M5 i ever went in was a V10 M5 like 2 years ago and wow!

My order
E36 M
E92 M
V10 M5

On the topic of prices of these cars, there is some proper junk out there being advertised as clean, straight, fresh, one of the best bla bla bla. The 2nd hand car market in SA has gone so dishonest it is flippin a sad state of affairs and unfortunately the few honest clean cars out there change hands without ever being advertised. When u look for an older M these days all the ads are 100% original, owner selling from his personal collection etc then u ask for details of the owners other cars in his collection and get a 😐. His others car are his Bejing family car and Suzuki swift becos it was a better buy than a Vivo (and no disrespect to the other brand here) but why on earth with a collector be selling a car than is apparently the last of the last and going up in price everyday. What happens is that someone puts up an ad with a decent car but oversells the story and crazy price and others see that immediately think pfff my car is way cleaner and they advertise theres for me lol.

Look 100-200-500k is not the same to everyone and some people do have the cash to just go and spend crazy amounts on an older M but the general public need to understand owning one of these older performance cars, whatever brand, u need be mechanical astute or have deep pockets or some combination. To maintain them properly which a few guys do and have invoices etc is not cheap and that why if u want that older M rather go to the 5 guys u know that have clean cars, taken care and tell them if they ever ready to sell call u and be patient and rather pay up for something u know about, has service history and seller is a honest trustworthy person. There is too much kak out there, saving 100k and buying a unknown can cost u way more in the long run. Clean older cars are getting harder to find so demand > supply will mean some upward price pressure + M premium + inflation + u compare and say new Golf R is over a bar so this must be a luck…
 

TurboLlew

Honorary ///Member
These are not straightforward comparisons with years and don't murder me on the figures if some are wrong. However it is the E34 and E39 generations that are the actual anomalies leading to the perception of the M5 vs M3 and then of course there is the fact that because of cost or simply availability fewer people even set foot in an M5... and so rely on the perceptions of articles with their own slants as well as those who chose the M3 supposedly over the M5 on merit and totally not because they'd have to buy an older one/couldn't stretch to a newer one... Also remembering that the M5 is a 4 door lounge on wheels that has much more practicality and "the tech" that everyone seems to like.

Don't get me wrong, the M3 is the benchmark... there is nothing quite like any of these cars which is why we love them. What I am talking about here is the perception that it is SO much heavier and somehow "like a boat" :ROFLMAO: (source: people who have never driven one). It is like a boat vs. a GT3 or something like my 4C/Lotus.

E28: 1465KG vs E30 1165 (195hp/ton vs 171hp/ton)

E34: 1710KG vs E36 1460 (182hp/ton vs 196hp/ton)
E39: 1795KG vs E46 1470 (220 hp/ton vs 230hp/ton)

Then something happens:

E60: 1848KG vs E90 1680 (250hp/ton vs 275hp/ton)
F10: 1870KG vs F80 1605 (299hp/ton vs 265 hp/ton)
F90: 1855KG vs G80 1810 (333hp/ton vs. 300hp/ton)

Another illustrative couple of references: my Alfa 4C with Novitec DP/Tune is at 341hp/ton which is another question I get frequently asked between my garagemates and how I am 'happy' with a tiny dumb little 1.75L when I have a beast next to it... A 992 GT3 RS has 362hp/ton and would (I think) be an appropriate upgrade.

Back on topic

I think perceptions of the M5 stem from E39 and earlier as well as people just not getting into them. From the E60 the power to weight differential has become much closer to the M3s and of course if you put a current gen M3 next to an E39, the effects of years of physical size gain will become very apparent.

That said, G90 is expected to be an eyewatering 2435kg so even with 718hp (295hp/ton), it is not going to be any faster than an F90 (333hp/ton) in a line and I am struggling to see how that would translate on a track. Watch how every influencer and media outlet is conveniently told to avoid comparisons to the F90 and focus on how it is as fast as a G80.

I think the perception of an M5 being 'too heavy' will once again be true. If I had R10 for every time someone at work/a client with an M3 or C63 went on about power to weight and didn't do the math, I'd have another M5 by now.

There is no bending of the laws of physics: It is usually that the reviewers or drivers don't expect power to have that much impact on weight (in exactly the same way when they get an extremely light car (orders of magnitude less weight) they cannot fathom how lightness changes dynamics). Unfortunately many have just experienced 'the average' and only have an idea of what lightness and 'big power' really are.

In our ratings of these cars, experience is often mentioned.... some will feel like a scalpel and some will feel like sledgehammers but in reality between generations we maintain a perception based on the badge even when they (by all measures and feeling) trade places or even take one another's places over time, certainly one gen vs the next.
 

Benji

Well-known member
Something that is really growing on me, keeping me busy on Youtube and keeping me awake at night...M6 V10 with a manual swap...One can pick up a "clean" one with relatively low miles and in an interesting colour for around 300k...will it be ruinously expensive to maintain? YES. Would it be worth it? Probably...

I wont comment on M cars I havent experienced, but talking from experience (and possibly reflected by used car pricing) I would pick an E34 540/6 with a 750iL 3.15LSD over an E34 M5 any day of the week except maybe at the waterless skidpan...
 

VinceM

Well-known member
Something that is really growing on me, keeping me busy on Youtube and keeping me awake at night...M6 V10 with a manual swap...One can pick up a "clean" one with relatively low miles and in an interesting colour for around 300k...will it be ruinously expensive to maintain? YES. Would it be worth it? Probably...

I wont comment on M cars I havent experienced, but talking from experience (and possibly reflected by used car pricing) I would pick an E34 540/6 with a 750iL 3.15LSD over an E34 M5 any day of the week except maybe at the waterless skidpan...

There is just something special about that F1 inspired engine. Even Srethen admitted that his E60 has dethroned his E39 M5.

Prices for M6s seems to be attractive vs M3 prices though you might be in for some hectic spend in repairs & maintenance.

Do it!

Honestly its hard to comment on cars that one had seat time in only for the simple reason of “Access” hence reading and research is our new friend. As an example, I have good seat time in F90 pre LCI, but none in F10…..so end up going with the many youtube reviews and articles to form an idea of what its like. The only Ferrari I have seat time in, is a 458 but you must hear my opinions on 488 ….
 
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