Serious Help needed!!! I need to make a decision..

[CamZo]

HI guys

Ok let me cut to the chase.....

2003 E46 M3 SMG = R199000
Silver - pre-facelift
SMG gearbox has been checked and mechanically is perfect plus I have a 2 year Guarantee on it.
Mileage - 114000 km

All round condition Good with a few scuff marks.

Right now the problem comes in what will consumption be and how many k's of a tank? aswell as what problems can I expect with getting an M3 and what do services cost?


All in all I'm comparing this to my E46 330d....

My current E46 330d 2004
Km - 165000km
consumption averaging 7l/100km
open road is 5l/100km
Everything mechanically is perfect no issues.

Thanks Guys!

 

[gpgold]

My opinion is this really depends on your budget and what you want out of a motorcar. So are you prepared to +- halve the amt of kilometers you are currently getting out of your diesel for the extra performance offered by the M?

Dont have an M3 so cant really comment on service costs...all that I do know is servicing my diesel is cheaper than servicing my old petrol BMWs due to the lack of spark plugs...but I'm guessing almost every part of an M car is going to be more pricey, so once more, if your budget can handle your craving for performance than go for it:dunno:...my R0.02 :=):

---

My opinion is this really depends on your budget and what you want out of a motorcar. So are you prepared to +- halve the amt of kilometers you are currently getting out of your diesel for the extra performance offered by the M?

Dont have an M3 so cant really comment on service costs...all that I do know is servicing my diesel is cheaper than servicing my old petrol BMWs due to the lack of spark plugs...but I'm guessing almost every part of an M car is going to be more pricey, so once more, if your budget can handle your craving for performance than go for it:dunno:...my R0.02 :=):

Or keep your 330d, get yourself a sportsbike and smoke M3's :rollsmile:

 

[Philip Foglar]

A great saying, "if it ain broke, don't fix..." - an M3 is an awesome car! But will it do what you want as a daily car like your 330d does? Personally not a fan of SMG gearboxes, prefer a smoother change from an auto, or better, a manual gearbox...

Have not driven either of the two cars, but can probably and safely say that the diesel has tons of superb grunt for daily traffic conditions whereas the M3 is going to want you to use revs for the same "effect" - not a bad thing, but something to consider. And then the fuel consumption - diesels are usually a lot more consistent from varying driving conditions compared to a petrol, but I agree that you would most likely see a doubling of fuel usage compared to the 330d. :thumbs:

But at the end of the day, the heart gets what the heart wants... :rollsmile:

 

[moranor@axis]

ive seen 13-15L/100 quoted on these cars often...

 

[Crash_Nemesis]

I have driven Burgy's M3 for many miles on many occasions, I swear between myself and Mr T, we have driven Burgy's car more than he has.. that being said, it gets around high 11l per 100km depending, I don't rape his car, but its fast, its loud and people stare and comment at it...

My supercharged 323i gets low 11l per 100km.. Its fast, its not loud, people don't even notice it.

Depends what you want out of the M3. I love giving people a massive surprise out of the 323 supercharged, but its not an M car... You just know when you are sitting in an M3, its that feeling, that knowledge of knowing ur driving a pure bred sports car. The grunt, the vibrations, the stiffness...

Thats why you buy a car... An M3 is not a luxury sedan. Thats why I want an M3... not for the overall speed, but because of the feeling you get when you sit inside her and start her up... the smile you'll get on your face, will erase the thought of the fuel consumption instantly. I promise you that.

 

[Bayn46]

Considering I get just under 11 on mine, with mostly open road driving, quite a few short distance trips.

Can easily see the figures that Moranor is quoting as true. That being said, I would never by a ///M with consumption in mind

 

[Philip Foglar]

I have driven Burgy's M3 for many miles on many occasions, I swear between myself and Mr T, we have driven Burgy's car more than he has.. that being said, it gets around high 11l per 100km depending, I don't rape his car, but its fast, its loud and people stare and comment at it...

My supercharged 323i gets low 11l per 100km.. Its fast, its not loud, people don't even notice it.

Depends what you want out of the M3. I love giving people a massive surprise out of the 323 supercharged, but its not an M car... You just know when you are sitting in an M3, its that feeling, that knowledge of knowing ur driving a pure bred sports car. The grunt, the vibrations, the stiffness...

Thats why you buy a car... An M3 is not a luxury sedan. Thats why I want an M3... not for the overall speed, but because of the feeling you get when you sit inside her and start her up... the smile you'll get on your face, will erase the thought of the fuel consumption instantly. I promise you that.

+1

Precisely! :thumbs:

 

[Crash_Nemesis]

I do however recall seeing Burgy's car with 13L per 100km before, but that was after a Track Day...

 

[Philip Foglar]

I do however recall seeing Burgy's car with 13L per 100km before, but that was after a Track Day...

And that's actually not bad - can see how topgear was able to show that an M3 is more economical driven flat out that a silly prius driven also 'flat out'! :rollsmile:

 

[CamZo]

:ty:Thank you all for your comments.... Some very valid points... what stands out the most is the consumption issue. I will be lying if I say consumption is not an issue... me still being a student ( as from monday I will be employed so yay :thumbs: ) and I'm honestly not considering buying it from a performance point of view but I'm thinking long term I will get more for an M few years from now then the diesel... and I wont put alot of km's on it.

But another thing that comes to mind is maybe I should get an E90 330d its in similar price range... and Ya. I'm so confused!

 

[silver_surfer]

i have recently bought a 2003 e46 m3 manual. still getting used to the rear wheel drive and havent been giving the loud pedal a beating as yet. i drive normally and am using about 12.4l/100km. off a tank i get about +/-400km.

drove to ceres recently and got 600km off the tank. nice ride though...

 

[calypso]

Your fuel consumption will just about double.
Here is a link to my fuelly page. Granted it do almost all city driving, you will be able to see where i take a long trip.

http://www.fuelly.com/driver/calypso/m3

 

[herr bmw]

personally i would buy the m3 for a weekend car,thats if your diesel is paid off.

dont know the prices on parts,but if it is like vw,and you say gti then the prices double,so expect the same from bmw.

send legacy and andgp1 a pm as they have got/had one and might be able to give more info

 

[kabal]

12.5-13.5 litres per 100 for me under normal.
long trips I can get 11 or a bit less.

how old are you? insurance plays a part in regards to running costs.

a oil service will set you back R1500 without labour (oil and filter), this should be done every 12500km or so.
spark plugs, another R1500ish exc labour
other consumables, same as e46

 

[Legacy]

330d vs M3, there is simply NO comparison. The cars are totally different in every single way imaginable. The consumption will be bad I can tell you that, sitting in traffic is a serious no no, the actual BMW urban quoted figure is 17l/100km and I can see that happening.

As to maintenance it depends on the car but remember as Kabal said just an oil change is around R1500 without labour. How well is the suspension? You do not want to go change shocks as it will be around R11k for a set. Make sure these are okay. The suspension should be rock hard, almost uncomfortable otherwise something is up.

Then you have tyres, remember no spare and the inflation kit is a joke so if you get a puncture firstly you will have to get towed (R750-R1500) then you need a new tyre (+-R2500). Then there are the brakes, new front disks are R2500 each and only available at the stealers since they are floating disks. Check when the brakes and tyres was replaced.

On to the actual engine, remember its a high revving engine with extremely low tolerances, its the engine with the third fastest piston speed found in a normal road car and the inter cylinder spacing is about 4mm. Try and check if the valve clearences have been adjusted as these should be adjusted every 35k-50k km, the kit is around R4200 excluding shipping and labour. Waterpump, viscous, thermostat, radiator and all the water hoses, these also need to be replaced before 135k-150k km. These are all very important so make sure if any has been replaced otherwise set up a budget for it.

Finally the drivetrain, you say the gearbox is perfectly fine which is good, then you need to check the prop and the diff, is there any vibration on the prop at around 60-80km/h and make sure the diff does not wine excessively.

As to the actual driving off the car it should feel right. What I mean by that is when I get into the ///M I get this feeling like this is how a car should feel like, everything is just perfect, the steering, the balance of the car, the driving position and so on. In terms of performance it should blow you away, I don't care how much torque you diesel makes when the ///M hits 6500-8000 rpm you should giggle like a girl.

Hope this helps and the car checks out, there is nothing as good as an ///M car for your soul. Hope to see some pics soon.

:thumbs:

 

[M3_FTW]

Mate, I am going to be perfectly honest here. If you are worried about things like fuel consumption then I wouldnt go for the M3.

My M3 averaged about 12.8L/100km in the 4 years I owned it, so your fuel consumption will double. However, this is my point. If you are concerned about the extra dollars to be spent on fuel then trust me, the M3 can get very expensive very quickly if something breaks.

If I was you I would budget 15-25k a year on maintenance and general upkeep and have a good couple of $$$$$ tucked away in case of something going bang.

Just my 2c

 

[wikk3d88]

Mate, I am going to be perfectly honest here. If you are worried about things like fuel consumption then I wouldnt go for the M3.

:thumbs:

 

[M3_FTW]

330d vs M3, there is simply NO comparison. The cars are totally different in every single way imaginable. The consumption will be bad I can tell you that, sitting in traffic is a serious no no, the actual BMW urban quoted figure is 17l/100km and I can see that happening.

As to maintenance it depends on the car but remember as Kabal said just an oil change is around R1500 without labour. How well is the suspension? You do not want to go change shocks as it will be around R11k for a set. Make sure these are okay. The suspension should be rock hard, almost uncomfortable otherwise something is up.

Then you have tyres, remember no spare and the inflation kit is a joke so if you get a puncture firstly you will have to get towed (R750-R1500) then you need a new tyre (+-R2500). Then there are the brakes, new front disks are R2500 each and only available at the stealers since they are floating disks. Check when the brakes and tyres was replaced.

On to the actual engine, remember its a high revving engine with extremely low tolerances, its the engine with the third fastest piston speed found in a normal road car and the inter cylinder spacing is about 4mm. Try and check if the valve clearences have been adjusted as these should be adjusted every 35k-50k km, the kit is around R4200 excluding shipping and labour. Waterpump, viscous, thermostat, radiator and all the water hoses, these also need to be replaced before 135k-150k km. These are all very important so make sure if any has been replaced otherwise set up a budget for it.

Finally the drivetrain, you say the gearbox is perfectly fine which is good, then you need to check the prop and the diff, is there any vibration on the prop at around 60-80km/h and make sure the diff does not wine excessively.

As to the actual driving off the car it should feel right. What I mean by that is when I get into the ///M I get this feeling like this is how a car should feel like, everything is just perfect, the steering, the balance of the car, the driving position and so on. In terms of performance it should blow you away, I don't care how much torque you diesel makes when the ///M hits 6500-8000 rpm you should giggle like a girl.

Hope this helps and the car checks out, there is nothing as good as an ///M car for your soul. Hope to see some pics soon.

:thumbs:

Just to point out a few things. Brake disks you can get from Powerbrake for a fraction of dealer prices and are better than the OEM units.

The servicing parts even clutch etc you can bring in from Turnermotorsport.com for also a fraction of the price. As long as you have the $$$$ to replace say for example and SMG Pump then I would say go for it.

They are very reliable but can get you into shit if you cant cover the maintenance.

 

[Legacy]

Just to point out a few things. Brake disks you can get from Powerbrake for a fraction of dealer prices and are better than the OEM units.

The servicing parts even clutch etc you can bring in from Turnermotorsport.com for also a fraction of the price. As long as you have the $$$$ to replace say for example and SMG Pump then I would say go for it.

They are very reliable but can get you into shit if you cant cover the maintenance.

I heard the PB disks are about R1500 each?

 

[CamZo]

Thanks guys for the response.... I got alot of thinking about to do!

personally i would buy the m3 for a weekend car,thats if your diesel is paid off.

dont know the prices on parts,but if it is like vw,and you say gti then the prices double,so expect the same from bmw.

send legacy and andgp1 a pm as they have got/had one and might be able to give more info

Yeah the 330d is paid off... Now I'm thinking maybe with the cash I'll spend on doing maintenance on getting it back to almost a new car experience example shocks etc

---

12.5-13.5 litres per 100 for me under normal.
long trips I can get 11 or a bit less.

how old are you? insurance plays a part in regards to running costs.

a oil service will set you back R1500 without labour (oil and filter), this should be done every 12500km or so.
spark plugs, another R1500ish exc labour
other consumables, same as e46

Ok that is quiet high for me as a daily drive....

I forgot about insurance I'm 21 so that'll sky rocket....

ya services will kill me financially and I dont have enough to cover a major breakdown...

---

330d vs M3, there is simply NO comparison. The cars are totally different in every single way imaginable. The consumption will be bad I can tell you that, sitting in traffic is a serious no no, the actual BMW urban quoted figure is 17l/100km and I can see that happening.

As to maintenance it depends on the car but remember as Kabal said just an oil change is around R1500 without labour. How well is the suspension? You do not want to go change shocks as it will be around R11k for a set. Make sure these are okay. The suspension should be rock hard, almost uncomfortable otherwise something is up.

Then you have tyres, remember no spare and the inflation kit is a joke so if you get a puncture firstly you will have to get towed (R750-R1500) then you need a new tyre (+-R2500). Then there are the brakes, new front disks are R2500 each and only available at the stealers since they are floating disks. Check when the brakes and tyres was replaced.

On to the actual engine, remember its a high revving engine with extremely low tolerances, its the engine with the third fastest piston speed found in a normal road car and the inter cylinder spacing is about 4mm. Try and check if the valve clearences have been adjusted as these should be adjusted every 35k-50k km, the kit is around R4200 excluding shipping and labour. Waterpump, viscous, thermostat, radiator and all the water hoses, these also need to be replaced before 135k-150k km. These are all very important so make sure if any has been replaced otherwise set up a budget for it.

Finally the drivetrain, you say the gearbox is perfectly fine which is good, then you need to check the prop and the diff, is there any vibration on the prop at around 60-80km/h and make sure the diff does not wine excessively.

As to the actual driving off the car it should feel right. What I mean by that is when I get into the ///M I get this feeling like this is how a car should feel like, everything is just perfect, the steering, the balance of the car, the driving position and so on. In terms of performance it should blow you away, I don't care how much torque you diesel makes when the ///M hits 6500-8000 rpm you should giggle like a girl.

Hope this helps and the car checks out, there is nothing as good as an ///M car for your soul. Hope to see some pics soon.

:thumbs:

Thanx Legacy your post has helped me in my decision. I am really not in any position to own an ///M at the moment I'll be shooting myself in foot. Maybe in a few years from now.... just the deal is soooo good hey I got excited to the point where I forgot reality lol

---

Mate, I am going to be perfectly honest here. If you are worried about things like fuel consumption then I wouldnt go for the M3.

:thumbs:

And this has closed the deal..... maybe in a few years time. The dealership is letting me use the car for the weekend so I'll get some joy atleast.:thumbs: